Barriers to belief

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So you are not the one who decides whether or not my claims are credible?

Do you think you should decide whether or not I find them credible?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So you are not the one who decides whether or not my claims are credible?

What evidence [that is credible to you] do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife? I will tell you if it is credible to me.

Originally posted by FMF
Do you think [b]you should decide whether or not I find them credible?[/b]

No I think you decide what is credible and what is not. I would like to know what criteria you use to do that.

Originally posted by FMF
What evidence [that is credible to you] do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife? I will tell you if it is credible to me.

What basis will you use to decide whether or not the evidence I present is credible or not?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
What basis will you use to decide whether or not the evidence I present is credible or not?

Just try me. What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife? I will treat each claim you make on what I perceive to be its merits.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
No I think you decide what is credible and what is not. I would like to know what criteria you use to do that.

With empirical things, I think you can weigh data and facts and make a decision. But I don't think it works. But you have absolutely no empirical data to offer in support of what you want me to weigh (i.e. your religious beliefs). I think with such intangible, philosophical, and sometimes hard to express thoughts and notions, that it is a realization and not a decision. If you don't agree with or accept this perception and my testimony, that's fine by me.

Originally posted by FMF
Just try me. What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife? I will treat each claim you make on what I perceive to be its merits.

Let's take the statement, "God exists". You believe this statement to be true. Therefore you find it credible. What evidence do you have that has convinced you of the credibility of this statement?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Let's take the statement, "God exists". You believe this statement to be true. Therefore you find it credible. What evidence do you have that has convinced you of the credibility of this statement?

No. Let's go with this one: What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?

Originally posted by FMF
No. Let's go with this one: What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?

So you don't require evidence for your own beliefs, but demand evidence for someone else's beliefs. Hypocritical don't you think?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So you don't require evidence for your own beliefs, but demand evidence for someone else's beliefs. Hypocritical don't you think?

Well, well. It's a core belief of all Christians, and yet "What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?" certainly seems to have hit a nerve.

I am not a proselytizer. You are. I am not concerned at all about whether or not you end up sharing my beliefs as a result of our interaction.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Let's take the statement, "God exists".

A belief or even a mere gut feeling that "God exists" ~ I am certainly open to the possibility that He does ~ really doesn't lend any credence to the specific doctrinal claims that you make about the supposed upshot of humans having been communicated with by the God which I think possibly exists and which you think definitely exists.

That's why I ask the question 'what evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?' If one looks at nature and feels persuaded that it might possibly be created and designed, it really does not follow on from that that we are (potentially) immortal. You think it does. The burden of proof is yours.

Originally posted by FMF
Well, well. It's a core belief of all Christians, and yet "What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?" certainly seems to have hit a nerve.

I am not a proselytizer. You are. I am not concerned at all about whether or not you end up sharing my beliefs as a result of our interaction.

So you only require evidence when it suits you. Which is hypocritical.

FMF: No [not "God exists"]. Let's go with this one: What evidence do you have that you are going on to live forever in the afterlife?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So you don't require evidence for your own beliefs, but demand evidence for someone else's beliefs. Hypocritical don't you think?

The evidence that we all die - get buried or cremated (mostly) - and that that is the end of our lives, is available and obvious to everyone. I have been attending funerals and paying my respects to people who are dead and gone in cemeteries for as long as I can remember. There is zero evidence that even a single one of those dead people is still somehow alive in some shape or form, somewhere. So, what evidence do you have to the contrary?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So you only require evidence when it suits you. Which is hypocritical.

Oh dear. You are unravelling. What "evidence" do you want? You are making the extraordinary claims about supernatural things ~ not me ~ and you offer no evidence at all. Just assertions. And your certainty. And sincerity. I am making no claims whatsoever about supernatural things. None. No claims. I am not asking you believe any claims about supernatural beings or events or about things like immortality and eternal torture and "sin".

Originally posted by FMF
The evidence that we all die - get buried or cremated (mostly) - and that that is the end of our lives, is available and obvious to everyone. I have been attending funerals and paying my respects to people who are dead and gone in cemeteries for as long as I can remember. There is zero evidence that even a single one of those dead people is still somehow alive in some shape or form, somewhere. So, what evidence do you have to the contrary?

If I told you that I had a gut feeling would that be ok with you? Or is it only ok if you have a gut feeling?