Hawking: Universe happened without god.

Originally posted by stellspalfie
how is this going one better?!?!? i make no claims of our origins other than what is known, which begins a few moments after the big bang. everything before that is unknown. there is no theory i know of that say something was created from nothing, there are some that suggest something appears in nothing, but where that something comes from is unknown.
...[text shortened]... know it must be a god, would you invoke the god of gaps when we set off for the horizon??

Isn't it amazing how the Holy Bible can give us such accurate insite back to the beginning of the heavens and the earth and the creation of the various forms of biological life on earth and continue with predictions of recent past that have come true and of the future that is expected to come true. No other book is like it for it is unique, one of a kind.

HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!

Originally posted by stellspalfie
the big bang, beyond that we do not know.

But I know there was no big bang, but only the sound of the voice of God when he spoke every physical thing into existence, because I read the Holy Bible, the amazing word of God on paper.

Originally posted by stellspalfie
how is this going one better?!?!? i make no claims of our origins other than what is known, which begins a few moments after the big bang. everything before that is unknown. there is no theory i know of that say something was created from nothing, there are some that suggest something appears in nothing, but where that something comes from is unknown.
...[text shortened]... know it must be a god, would you invoke the god of gaps when we set off for the horizon??

Really you see something appearing in nothing as different than something
created in nothing? Where did this something appear in the nothing since there
was no place to be? Creation gives answers where the (unknown/unknowable)
Is all science has, I've yet to see anyone get past the question, where did every
Thing come from?
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Really you see something appearing in nothing as different than something
created in nothing? Where did this something appear in the nothing since there
was no place to be? Creation gives answers where the (unknown/unknowable)
Is all science has, I've yet to see anyone get past the question, where did every
Thing come from?
Kelly

The honest scientist says we don't know. However, as Dasa would say, "The dishonest scientist makes up something like a singularity or a primordial soup."

Originally posted by RJHinds
The honest scientist says we don't know. However, as Dasa would say, "The [b]dishonest scientist makes up something like a singularity or a primordial soup."[/b]

I don't think it is dishonest to come up with some story on how it may have
happened, as long as you don't try to push it off as that was how it happened.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Really you see something appearing in nothing as different than something
created in nothing? Where did this something appear in the nothing since there
was no place to be? Creation gives answers where the (unknown/unknowable)
Is all science has, I've yet to see anyone get past the question, where did every
Thing come from?
Kelly

yes it is very different. something appearing in a void that was created in another universe is very different than something appearing or being created in a universe that has no previous other existence.

we dont know where the 'something' has appeared from, this is the current edge of what we know and are striving to answer. im not sure what point you are making, are you saying that because science doesnt know where the 'something' comes from that we never will or that some how the science we do know is wrong? what does it prove to you that science currently doesnt have all the answers.


'Where did this something appear'

when we talk of 'something appearing we are not talking about one event. things appear in the universe seemingly from nowhere all the time. the 'something' is energy. in your view of the world where is this energy coming from?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I don't think it is dishonest to come up with some story on how it may have
happened, as long as you don't try to push it off as that was how it happened.
Kelly

Okay, if they wish to make a fictional story that may have happened, like Startrek or Star Wars or even The Planet of the Apes then they should acknowledge it as such, but they try to push it off on us as a scientific theory that is fact or almost fact only needing a few details to be worked out. This is what Dasa means by dishonest. However, I usually use the Biblical term and call them liars.

Originally posted by stellspalfie
yes it is very different. something appearing in a void that was created in another universe is very different than something appearing or being created in a universe that has no previous other existence.

we dont know where the 'something' has appeared from, this is the current edge of what we know and are striving to answer. im not sure what point ...[text shortened]... the 'something' is energy. in your view of the world where is this energy coming from?

Obviously, if you had half a brain, you should know we believe it originally comes from God.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Obviously, if you had half a brain, you should know we believe it originally comes from God.

by 'we' i mean the intelligent scientists at the cutting edge of knowledge, i wasnt including the superstitious, cousin lovin'crazies like your good self.

Originally posted by stellspalfie
yes it is very different. something appearing in a void that was created in another universe is very different than something appearing or being created in a universe that has no previous other existence.

we dont know where the 'something' has appeared from, this is the current edge of what we know and are striving to answer. im not sure what point ...[text shortened]... the 'something' is energy. in your view of the world where is this energy coming from?

I think the word nothing is beyond you.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
So you are refusing to answer for some reason?
Kelly

No, I answered. Unfortunately you insist that I either believe everything comes from something or everything comes from something. I don't believe either of those extremes.

Originally posted by Kepler
No, I answered. Unfortunately you insist that I either believe everything comes from something or everything comes from something. I don't believe either of those extremes.

Now, that is proof.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Now, that is proof.

I must find a way to post a picture of the front of a T-shirt I have. It depicts two mathematicians fighting in front of a chalk board with the caption "You want proof? I'll give you proof!"

Originally posted by Kepler
No, I answered. Unfortunately you insist that I either believe everything comes from something or everything comes from something. I don't believe either of those extremes.

So to avoid the question about where everything here comes from using God
who is not apart of this universe, you think using some mythical place is valid?
The issue I think you run into doing that is where did that place come from if it
is nothing more than another universe, if you want to say it is eternal, other
than it suits you for keeping God out of the equation, why do you make that
claim?

Not sure what you are saying here,
"I either believe everything comes from something or everything comes from something. I don't believe either of those extremes"
since you are repeating yourself while claiming there are two different paths.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
I believe I can do better than that, you cannot show me anything that you
don't believe came from something else! It seems all science does is look
backwards as to what came before what we see now, we date the whole
universe with a period of time which I'd point out declares a start for
everything! The trouble you have is that by doing that a major hole ...[text shortened]... ? A change requires a cause or reason, a static state does nothing but
remain static.
Kelly

The ironic thing here is you are like being arrogant and nasty to a few 5 year old kids, because that is the state of science now, in its infancy. In another 100 years, science will maybe be a teenager. A snot nosed teenager who will shove your dogma out of the water of your ignorance and show you exactly what the universe is made of. Till then, have fun bullying the babies.