16 Oct 10
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneNo, it was not always wrong, or an abomination, you may view it as wrong
Yes it is. Slavery in all its forms always was, is and always will be an abomination. Just as explicitly giving approval (as was given in Leviticus 25) to acquire and possess slaves always was, is and always will be an abomination.
It's unfortunate that so many Christians on this thread continue to deny these truths. They are blind to these truths.
throughtout all time, but other times did not view it that way which means during
that time with those people it was thought of as acceptable. You viewing as wrong
during all times is not the same thing as it being wrong at all times.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by KellyJayThats totally illogical. It has nothing to do with time. There are people nowadays who see nothing wrong with slavery and there were people in the past who saw it as immoral (most slaves probably did). It doesn't make sense to try and justify past wrongs as being acceptable because the date has changed.
No, it was not always wrong, or an abomination, you may view it as wrong
throughtout all time, but other times did not view it that way which means during
that time with those people it was thought of as acceptable. You viewing as wrong
during all times is not the same thing as it being wrong at all times.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by KellyJayLet me just clarify your position - you are now no longer asserting that slavery was not seen as immoral in the past and are instead taking the view that god condoned the practice in order to motivate people to desire to be free of sin?
I believe as I said earlier too, that life lessons were brought about due to the
setup God allowed. Being bound is the normal human condition after fall of man,
seeing slavery lets us know how bad that state of being a slave to sin we are in is,
and gives us the desire to be free of it. Forbidding other gods also a life lesson
that was taugh a different way.
Kelly
And I was talking about commandment 2, not commandment 1.
16 Oct 10
1 edit
Originally posted by KellyJayYou seem to be speaking of the perception of the practice of slavery by portions of various cultures throughout time.
No, it was not always wrong, or an abomination, you may view it as wrong
throughtout all time, but other times did not view it that way which means during
that time with those people it was thought of as acceptable. You viewing as wrong
during all times is not the same thing as it being wrong at all times.
Kelly
I was speaking of the practice of slavery itself. Hopefully you can understand the distinction.
Regardless, the following still stands:
"Slavery in all its forms always was, is and always will be an abomination. Just as explicitly giving approval (as was given in Leviticus 25) to acquire and possess slaves always was, is and always will be an abomination.
It's unfortunate that so many Christians on this thread continue to deny these truths. They are blind to these truths."
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by twhiteheadTwo discussions here.
Thats totally illogical. It has nothing to do with time. There are people nowadays who see nothing wrong with slavery and there were people in the past who saw it as immoral (most slaves probably did). It doesn't make sense to try and justify past wrongs as being acceptable because the date has changed.
1. Slavery is bad no matter when we see it in time or space, because we say so.
2. Slavery was acceptable in another time, so during their time it was okay.
You want to tell me that no matter what those people said, did, thought when
they were alive under the conditions they were in, they were all wrong and your
views here and those that agree with you are the only ones right?
You and yours are that important!?
If you want to tell me that there is a standard of right and wrong that all of us
are bound to no matter what we think and the conditions we live in, and that
standard cannot be changed because we are bound to its laws/rules I'd say
whoever came up with that standard cannot be human. If you are saying it is
human to figure it out for ourselves we go back to one opinion over another.
If you want to say again that there is a standard that we are bound too, I suggest
God is the only one with that right to hold us to it, since if it were just among us
to figure it all out, that means we have different opinions so the debate will just
go on.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by avalanchethecatI'm taking the position God allowed it with boundaries, He has reasons for it I'm
Let me just clarify your position - you are now no longer asserting that slavery was not seen as immoral in the past and are instead taking the view that god condoned the practice in order to motivate people to desire to be free of sin?
And I was talking about commandment 2, not commandment 1.
sure. He allows quite a few things I dislike, just because I view slavery as wrong,
and I do view it as wrong, I have to accept it as I do death, pain, and suffering.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by KellyJayAs I posted earlier:
Two discussions here.
1. Slavery is bad no matter when we see it in time or space, because we say so.
2. Slavery was acceptable in another time, so during their time it was okay.
You want to tell me that no matter what those people said, did, thought when
they were alive under the conditions they were in, they were all wrong and your
views here and t ...[text shortened]... figure it all out, that means we have different opinions so the debate will just
go on.
Kelly
"Slavery always was, is and always will be an abomination, just as torturing children always was, is and always will be an abomination.
These practices are abhorrent to everyone who have compassion for their fellow human beings, i.e., love their neighbors as themselves."
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneThere are many things in the OT, which is not applicable today. The Law of Moses or sometimes it is referred to as the Mosaic Law is part of the OT and has laws, which today are viewed less than appropriate. In the New Testament Jesus taught more about Love and Forgiveness, which many Christians should be following and I believe everyone should benefit from.
You seem to be speaking of the perception of the practice of slavery by portions of various cultures throughout time.
I was speaking of the practice of slavery itself. Hopefully you can understand the distinction.
Regardless, the following still stands:
"Slavery in all its forms always was, is and always will be an abomination. Just as explicitl ...[text shortened]... any Christians on this thread continue to deny these truths. They are blind to these truths."
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by KellyJaywell said Kelly
No, it was not always wrong, or an abomination, you may view it as wrong
throughtout all time, but other times did not view it that way which means during
that time with those people it was thought of as acceptable. You viewing as wrong
during all times is not the same thing as it being wrong at all times.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by gtbiking4lifeclearly
There are many things in the OT, which is not applicable today. The Law of Moses or sometimes it is referred to as the Mosaic Law is part of the OT and has laws, which today are viewed less than appropriate. In the New Testament Jesus taught more about Love and Forgiveness, which many Christians should be following and I believe everyone should benefit from.
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by KellyJayThis is very profound, Kelly
I believe as I said earlier too, that life lessons were brought about due to the
setup God allowed. Being bound is the normal human condition after fall of man,
seeing slavery lets us know how bad that state of being a slave to sin we are in is,
and gives us the desire to be free of it. Forbidding other gods also a life lesson
that was taugh a different way.
Kelly
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by gtbiking4lifeHow does this apply to what I posted? Or in other words: How would you apply this to what I posted?
There are many things in the OT, which is not applicable today. The Law of Moses or sometimes it is referred to as the Mosaic Law is part of the OT and has laws, which today are viewed less than appropriate. In the New Testament Jesus taught more about Love and Forgiveness, which many Christians should be following and I believe everyone should benefit from.
16 Oct 10
1 edit
Originally posted by gtbiking4lifeI think I understand what you're trying to say. However I still don't understand how you specifically see it as applying to my post. This reads more like a summary of your post. Can you point to the specific statements in my post you believe it applies to and tell me how it applies to each one?
Slavery is not good and we know this today. If we lived back in the times of Leviticus, I wonder if we would all give the same answer.
16 Oct 10
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneSo what?
As I posted earlier:
"Slavery always was, is and always will be an abomination, just as torturing children always was, is and always will be an abomination.
These practices are abhorrent to everyone who have compassion for their fellow human beings, i.e., love their neighbors as themselves."
Kelly