22 Jun 07
Originally posted by StarrmanThis form of Christianity just doesn't exist in England (to my knowledge). Where did all this stuff come from? 🙁
Don't bother, some people just fail to realise that it's not the messenger that's important, it's the message. He's to concerned with spreading the word to actually live it, don't waste your time on him. Lets face it, if Jesus came back he'd be ashamed of people like him, to think he died so that others could breed vengance, hellfire and retribution...
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by PhuzudakaSo everyone whose perception is warped by sin knows that their perception is warped by sin?
Everyone who is still under the power of sin knows it. Those who have been slaves to sin and have experienced freedom also know it.
If this is the case then I am not under the power of sin since I am unaware of being so. My perception is not warped by sin, since I am unaware of it being so.
Surely you meant we are blinded by sin. In which case, nobody can know whether this is the case or not since, if they are blinded by sin, they will be blinded to the fact that they are blinded. As already mentioned a few posts ago.
Essentially, in the space of a few posts you've done a 180 degree turn. You were saying that our perceptions are warped and now you say that we are fully aware of the true situation. These statements are in complete opposition to each other.
--- Penguin.
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by PhuzudakaSo if I don't know it then I can be sure that I am not under the power of sin nor have I ever been!
Everyone who is still under the power of sin knows it. Those who have been slaves to sin and have experienced freedom also know it.
But how do you know all that if you perceptions are seriously warped?
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by MarinkatombNot in your traditional CofE / Catholic / Protestant churches but there are some born again evangelical groups that have this flavour in the UK.
This form of Christianity just doesn't exist in England (to my knowledge). Where did all this stuff come from? 🙁
--- Penguin
22 Jun 07
1 edit
Originally posted by PenguinI remember meeting this chick in the street a couple of years ago. She handed me this leaflet which had a picture of a family having a picnic in what could only be described as the garden of Eden. There was a flipping LION sitting next to them! It was such a gloriously misguided vision of happiness i had to try and stop myself from laughing out loud! She proceeded to roll off this shpeal about Jesus that was frankly, made up. She had these little books which were an edited bible. I'm actually rather gutted i didn't buy one (they were only a pound) but i didn't want to contribute one penny to this cult. These people who prey on peoples faith are worse than evil!
Not in your traditional CofE / Catholic / Protestant churches but there are some born again evangelical groups that have this flavour in the UK.
--- Penguin
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by MarinkatombThe point you seem to be missing is that Jesus came to save sinners. He came to set us free from the bondage of sin.
Look man, did Jesus ever chastise people? I can't remember him doing any of this stuff from my childhood readings (my memory migh be selective here, it's been a while). What gives you the right? The Bible, by and by, has a positive message. Why do people get so damned richeous about it. Lets face it, when Jesus came to Earth, everyone would have been a s ...[text shortened]... ht? No one was a christian yet. Did he go around with fire and brimstone? No! Give it a rest!!
Do you have a problem with that? Or do you just like your sin too much?
22 Jun 07
2 edits
Originally posted by PenguinI was referring to a warped perception of God, which is caused by sin.
So everyone whose perception is warped by sin knows that their perception is warped by sin?
If this is the case then I am not under the power of sin since I am unaware of being so. My perception is not warped by sin, since I am unaware of it being so.
Surely you meant we are blinded by sin. In which case, nobody can know whether this is the case or not the true situation. These statements are in complete opposition to each other.
--- Penguin.
Do you mean to say that you were born without a conscience?
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by PhuzudakaNo i don't have a problem with Jesus, i have a problem with you! Your over simplified interpretation of the Bible and it's message is frankly naive.
The point you seem to be missing is that Jesus came to save sinners. He came to set us free from the bondage of sin.
Do you have a problem with that? Or do you just like your sin too much?
22 Jun 07
1 edit
Originally posted by MarinkatombWow you are quick to jump to conclusions!
No i don't have a problem with Jesus, i have a problem with you! Your over simplified interpretation of the Bible and it's message is frankly naive.
So tell me, what do you think was the purpose for which Jesus was born?
Matthew 1:21
"...and thou shalt call his name JESUS; for he shall save his people from their sins."
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by PhuzudakaYou said:
I was referring to a warped perception of God, which is caused by sin.
And there are many people in this world whose perceptions have been seriously warped by the degenerate effect of sin.
So you are now saying you made a mistake and omitted the word "of God" somewhere in the middle of that? Why didn't you say that earlier instead of wasting our time?
Do you mean to say that you were born without a conscience?
So, in light or your modification to your original claim, you were also claiming that everyone who is still under the power of sin knows that their perception of God is warped.
Now does not knowing that your perception of God is warped lead you to the conclusion that you have no conscience?
22 Jun 07
Originally posted by PhuzudakaI was referring to a warped perception of God, which is caused by sin.
I was referring to a warped perception of God, which is caused by sin.
Do you mean to say that you were born without a conscience?
Well you didn't say that. You said "And there are many people in this world whose perceptions have been seriously warped by the degenerate effect of sin.
Do you mean to say that you were born without a conscience?
I assume you are referring to my statement: "If this is the case then I am not under the power of sin since I am unaware of being so. My perception is not warped by sin, since I am unaware of it being so." which says nothing about having or not having a concience. I was just exploring the implications of you assertion that who who are 'under the power of sin' are aware of it, which I'm sure is not what you meant to say.
As an aside, yes I believe I was born without a concience, and without conciousness for that matter. Conciousness develops in the first year or so of life and concience develops after that. Neither are there at the moment of birth.
--- Penguin.
22 Jun 07
1 edit
Originally posted by PhuzudakaLook, i'm sorry, i'm just not prepared to play this game with you. I know the Bible states this, however i am an atheist (surprisingly enough, given the title of this thread). I do not, as i have already stated, believe the bible to be the word of God or Jesus. It is the word of man. Please feel free to quote away, you might as well quote from the Bhagavadgiitaa, it too has some lovely messages (i suggest you read it, it's great!)
Wow you are quick to jump to conclusions!
So tell me, what do you think was the purpose for which Jesus was born?
Matthew 1:21
"...and thou shalt call his name JESUS; for he shall save his people from their sins."
Why don't you read some of my posts from earlier, they give a pretty detailed description of my feelings towards Christianity. If you want to come at me and call me a sinner, i take deep personal offense to that! How DARE you make such a claim when you have never met me! Your religion doesn't give you a blue paper to go around accusing people of such stuff. I don't believe in your God, if he exists then he will be my judge, NOT you!