The Enlightenment Culture and Creative Reason

Originally posted by lioyank
if your bedrock thing was meant for some other purpose, im sorry and what was it supposed to symbolize?

Bedrock = basic, fundamental: solid.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Bedrock = basic, fundamental: solid.

lol Wilma gonna clobber Fred when he gets home in da morning.
Seriously , that quote shows a contempt of freedom and equates to " You're free to do what I tell you to do".
It did sound like " Yabba dabba doo"

Originally posted by frogstomp
Seriously , that quote shows a contempt of freedom and equates to " You're free to do what I tell you to do".
It did sound like " Yabba dabba doo"

I'm interpreting, not quoting, so maybe I'm the one who's gibbering, but that's what I think he's at.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
I'm interpreting, not quoting, so maybe I'm the one who's gibbering, but that's what I think he's at.

Considering his role in suppressing the left in the church anything he says about freedom makes me think of a quote from the movie 'The Outlaw Josie Wales' :
"Don't piss down my back, and tell me it's raining"

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
They live in Bedrock.

.... and, if my memory serves me well, it was Fred and Wilma ..... unless Fred got a divorce and got married again.

Originally posted by ivanhoe
.... and, if my memory serves me well, it was Fred and Wilma ..... unless Fred got a divorce and got married again.

Lol, that's why Frogstomp commented that Fred was going to get it when Wilma got home. I must have lost touch with my cartoon roots...or maybe Fred's adultery is material to this discussion, I don't know.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Lol, that's why Frogstomp commented that Fred was going to get it when Wilma got home. I must have lost touch with my cartoon roots...or maybe Fred's adultery is material to this discussion, I don't know.

😀

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Freedom (people are at leisure to pick & choose among the cornucopia of items for sale in the (ethical, moral, spiritual) supermarkets of today) is slavery (lacking any authoritative basis for their choices, people are reduced to their personal preferences; their choices are convenient but meaningless; their actions are ultimately pred ...[text shortened]... return to bedrock values so that Fred & Thelma can have a sound moral basis for decision-making?

I disagree (that your statement is an accurate precis of Cardinal Ratzinger's speech). The following statement of his best exemplifies his position:

A confused ideology of freedom leads to dogmatism, which is showing itself increasingly hostile to freedom.

Originally posted by lucifershammer
I disagree (that your statement is an accurate precis of Cardinal Ratzinger's speech). The following statement of his best exemplifies his position:

A confused ideology of freedom leads to dogmatism, which is showing itself increasingly hostile to freedom.

Dogmatism is always hostile to freedom.

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom? How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Dogmatism is always hostile to freedom.

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom? How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

Ratzinger's position is " freedom is what I TELL you it is"

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Dogmatism is always hostile to freedom.

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom? How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

I've already provided two instances of this in my earlier discussion in this thread with vistesd ("hate speech" laws and the ordination of women as re: the European Constitution). There is also the French law banning religious accessories from schools, for instance.

Originally posted by lucifershammer
I've already provided two instances of this in my earlier discussion in this thread with vistesd ("hate speech" laws and the ordination of women as re: the European Constitution). There is also the French law banning religious accessories from schools, for instance.

What's the solution to these problems? How should governments perform their duties in these matters? French law is very clear on separation of religion & state; however, I'm sure religious accessories are not banned from private religious schools. The "hate speech" laws wouldn't have sprung up had certain religious leaders not seen it incumbent upon them to encourage their followers to kill. (The ordination of women is another story...a very interesting one, to be sure.)

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Dogmatism is always hostile to freedom.

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom? How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

Please take a look at the "Erosion of civil liberties" thread in the Debates forum and the posts I wrote.

Originally posted by ivanhoe
Please take a look at the "Erosion of civil liberties" thread in the Debates forum and the posts I wrote.

It's ok, LH brought me up to speed.

Perhaps the European Constitution is biased against the Catholic Church? It would be interesting to see another confrontation between Church & State--on the issue of female ordainment?--what sort of battles would be fought, on what battlegrounds and with what weapons.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Dogmatism is always hostile to freedom.

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom? How, specifically, is the freedom of Catholics being restricted?

Now, what is the Pope's definition of freedom?

I don't recall having read a "definition" of freedom by either Pope Benedict XVI or Pope John Paul II the Great; but I think it would go along the lines of:

the ability to realise the fulness of our potential as beings created in the image and likeness of God and endowed with dignity