The god who burns people alive for eternity

@secondson said
This is my preliminary reply. I know you're passionate about this topic, so I want to give it serious thought and consideration before attempting a reply.

At the earliest it will be later tonight. I have a wedding to attend today, (not my own) and some things to do now.

Hopefully we can arrive at an understanding and lay this question to rest.

Judging from your posting history your so called 'understanding' is limited and retarded by your church indoctrination. Proper understanding comes from taking the all teachings of the bible which speak clearly of the matter. I already asked another poster who believes in eternal torment to produce a clear scripture about two things and he failed to provide any. You will no doubt be unable to provide it.

Here they are :

1 that the lake of fire is a place of torment and anyone cast in is tormented for eternity.
2 that man has an immortal soul that cannot die.

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

If a loving God truly exists my friend, nobody is in danger of eternal torment.

Nobody.

Why did Jesus say of the one who betrayed Him, that it would have been good for him to have never been born ? Is it because Jesus had no love ?

"The Son of Man is going away, even as it is written concerning Him, but woe to that man through whom the Son of Man is betrayed!

It would have been good for that man if he had not been born.

And Judas, who was betraying Him, answered and said, I am the not the one, am I, Rabbi? And He said to him,

You have said it yourself." (Matthew 26:24,25)

Jesus was not a God-man of love, manifesting no love?

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

When I was 13 I had a schoolfriend, Stephen, who was a really easy going guy who I'd known since primary school (had attended many of his birthday parties). He was the kind of kid who would have helped anybody and not said boo to a goose. Anyway, for whatever reason, he befriended a kid a few years older who was an outright bully. I still remember vividly during the summer holidays, playing tennis with the younger brother of another friend, when Stephen and this older kid decided to come and give us a hard time. While the older kid threatened me with a bottle, Stephen wound down the tennis net to prevent us from playing.

Any God who would burn people alive for all eternity is such a bully, and any Christian who would stand quietly in his shadow and not protest, is just another Stephen.

Thank you for sharing your personal experience there.

I don't share your conclusion or your accusation against God per se.

God has a job to inform us of something beyond our experience "under the sun" (as Solomon said) and on the this side of the last judgment at the end of time.

I asked Dive to demonstrate that death meant non-existence in the Bible. He never did it to my recollection.

Since it is impossible for us to really comprehend some of these matters, He has to communicate to us truth in terms in which we can get it.

We will not enjoy remaining unforgiven and eternally separated from God. We will not enjoy being frozen in that kind of nature and unreconciled, unredeemed.

The terms by which God communicates this to us is His responsibly to warn us. And some of it may be preposterous because under the sun, in this realm of physical life, they sound impossible or too terrible.

As I read through the entire Bible, this feeling is neutralized when I see that His word in every regard should be taken with seriousness, though we cannot explain everything about those words.

The accumulative case is that I would be a fool to think He lies or speaks empty things not to be taken seriously.

Ghost, you do as you need to do.

@rajk999 said
If the doctrine was stated in the bible you would have provided the references. So far all you have is church assumptions. I rest my case.

Revelation 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Matthew 25:41
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Matthew 23:33
You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell?

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.

Revelation 19:20
And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who in its presence had done the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with sulfur.

Revelation 20:10
and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

@kellyjay said
Revelation 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Matthew 25:41
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Matthew 23:33
You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell?

Matthew ...[text shortened]... ere the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

I guess you got nothing. We are looking for biblical proof for two things

1 that the lake of fire is a place of torment and anyone cast in is tormented for eternity.
2 that man has an immortal soul that cannot die.

Try again.

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

If a loving God truly exists my friend, nobody is in danger of eternal torment.

Nobody.

Why did Jesus say of the one who betrayed Him, that it would have been good for him to have never been born ? Is it because Jesus had no love ?

"The Son of Man is going away, even as it is written concerning Him, but woe to that man ...[text shortened]... f." (Matthew 26:24,25)

Jesus was not a God-man of love, manifesting no love?

Sorry, my reference was in relation to a loving God. Clearly you disqualify your own deity if you believe He torments people for all eternity.

@rajk999 said
I guess you got nothing. We are looking for biblical proof for two things

1 that the lake of fire is a place of torment and anyone cast in is tormented for eternity.
2 that man has an immortal soul that cannot die.

Try again.

You asked for scripture you got it, Jesus is casting people into the lake of fire that was prepared for the devil and his angels. So everyone cast into the same place as the devil and his angels are going to end up in hell, where it is said that, "... they will be tormented day and night forever and ever." Disappearing after a little suffering isn't being tormented day and night forever and ever.


Matthew 25:41
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

What occurs there is simple.


Revelation 20:10
and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

@kellyjay said
You asked for scripture you got it, Jesus is casting people into the lake of fire that was prepared for the devil and his angels. So everyone cast into the same place as the devil and his angels are going to end up in hell, where it is said that, "... they will be tormented day and night forever and ever." Disappearing after a little suffering isn't being tormented day and n ...[text shortened]... ere the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

You got any Community Colleges near to you?
Take a course in English Comprehension.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Sorry, my reference was in relation to a loving God. Clearly you disqualify your own deity if you believe He torments people for all eternity.

Your error is that you cherry-pick the traits of what you think God should be. If God only behaved like you would if you were God. All the while, ignoring all there is about God to grasp who He really is. God is more than just love, He is good, just, righteous, with all of that and more! God is Holy, keeping all aspects of His nature in total agreement, complete harmony!

We can distort what can be known of God by suggesting He can only do this because of love while ignoring He is also just and right. The Holy nature is in play at times with every word said, and deed done. He will not overlook evil, He cannot be just, and good ignoring wrongs were done to Him and to those He loves, either.

I would suggest the torment will be the realization that no one had to be there, God had made a provision that was denied, or ignored. The suffering is the place designed for the devil and the angels.

@kellyjay said
Your error is that you cherry-pick the traits of what you think God should be. If God only behaved like you would if you were God. All the while, ignoring all there is about God to grasp who He really is. God is more than just love, He is good, just, righteous, with all of that and more! God is Holy, keeping all aspects of His nature in total agreement, complete harmony!

...[text shortened]... ision that was denied, or ignored. The suffering is the place designed for the devil and the angels.

Are you seriously suggesting that everyone who lived from Adam to now must have heard or known of this offer of God?

You really are the biggest Jacka$$ in town.

@rajk999 said
You got any Community Colleges near to you?
Take a course in English Comprehension.

How do you read, "...tormented day and night forever and ever." your comprehension tells you what, it occurs until they dissolve into nothingness or that it is an ever-ending fate? You once again leave the topic to insult. If the truth were on your side, that alone would be all that is required to prove your point. Since it isn't, you sink into an insult, you do that quite a bit here.

@kellyjay said
How do you read, "...tormented day and night forever and ever." your comprehension tells you what, it occurs until they dissolve into nothingness or that it is an ever-ending fate? You once again leave the topic to insult. If the truth were on your side, that alone would be all that required to prove your point. Since it isn't, you sink into an insult as is what you do quite a bit here.

Why did you quote part of the sentence? I will tell you. You are a deceitful fool that cannot carry on a fair discussion. That sentence includes a part where ONLY 3 beings face such torment.

The question is what is the fate of PEOPLE who are judged to be unbelievers.

@rajk999 said
Are you seriously suggesting that everyone who lived from Adam to now must have heard or known of this offer of God?

You really are the biggest Jacka$$ in town.

If the truth were what you were about that should be all that you need.

@rajk999 said
Why did you quote part of the sentence? I will tell you. You are a deceitful fool that cannot carry on a fair discussion. That sentence includes a part where ONLY 3 beings face such torment.

The question is what is the fate of PEOPLE who are judged to be unbelievers.

You don't follow along conversations well. You also don't know context of each of the passages either.

Revelation 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Matthew 25:41
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

@rajk999 said
Why did you quote part of the sentence? I will tell you. You are a deceitful fool that cannot carry on a fair discussion. That sentence includes a part where ONLY 3 beings face such torment.

The question is what is the fate of PEOPLE who are judged to be unbelievers.

Revelation 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.