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15 Sep 19
@kellyjay saidAnytime you feel like actually addressing the specific challenge in my OP please feel free to go ahead and do so.
Not loving is a flaw; one of the biggest there is, as part of the two greatest commandments. So God, who is love, creates the universe, and it is called very good. He sets up the world, so love can be expressed and experienced, which can only be done by those that can either love or not. God gives us everything we need for life; life at the beginning was all set up to flouri ...[text shortened]... going bad fast brother murdering brother was one of the first. A lack of love right out of the box!
15 Sep 19
@divegeester saidIt seems the ideology is that one is "saved" for believing one is "saved" and one is tortured forever for NOT believing one is "saved".
You believe that Jesus will be in Hell overseeing the eternal burning alive of billions of non Christians because that failed to believe that he LOVED them so much that he came and died for them.
What utter nonsense.
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15 Sep 19
@fmf saidThe ideology has several fundamental flaws:
It seems the ideology is that one is "saved" for believing one is "saved" and one is tortured forever for NOT believing one is "saved".
1) it is unscriptural - literal interpretations of monsters and whores and lakes of fire is the stuff of Hollywood and children
2) it is morally abhorrent - supernaturally keeping billions of people alive simply so a despotic maniac can keep burning them in said lake has to be a vision of Satan if anything.
3) it is counter productive in its aim - the control of people - it repels the non Christians and ignites (pun intended) Christians like myself.
4) it is “anti christ” yes absolutely anti-Christ’s message of mercy and hope and love. John 3 16 etc.
5) it is illogical - why would Jesus bother? It’s huge effort and what does it gain here or in eternity, nothing.
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I guarantee that not one of these Christians will have the either ability to counter my challenge in the OP and demonstrate that these LITERAL scripture mean something other than burning people alive, nor will they have the balls to come right out and say “yep that’s what it is, what it means and it’s Jesus perfect justice”
What we see are dozens of furball posts from sonship and KellyJay waffling around the subject posting scripture and basically saying “it’s what the bible says”
Let’s see.
15 Sep 19
The hard truth is that nobody really knows the truth, about Heaven or hell.....it's all speculation based on how one interprets the Bible. We won't know for sure until we die.
It's comparable to saying Trinity believers go to Heaven, but Godhead believers don't.
Who really knows? Nobody.
15 Sep 19
@chaney3 saidSo what are you now? An agnostic of some kind?
The hard truth is that nobody really knows the truth, about Heaven or hell.....it's all speculation based on how one interprets the Bible. We won't know for sure until we die.
It's comparable to saying Trinity believers go to Heaven, but Godhead believers don't.
Who really knows? Nobody.
15 Sep 19
@chaney3 saidIs today one of your today "I'm not a Christian today" days?
The hard truth is that nobody really knows the truth, about Heaven or hell.....it's all speculation based on how one interprets the Bible. We won't know for sure until we die.
It's comparable to saying Trinity believers go to Heaven, but Godhead believers don't.
Who really knows? Nobody.
15 Sep 19
@chaney3 saidI believe you are correct on this one.
The hard truth is that nobody really knows the truth, about Heaven or hell.....it's all speculation based on how one interprets the Bible. We won't know for sure until we die.
It's comparable to saying Trinity believers go to Heaven, but Godhead believers don't.
Who really knows? Nobody.
I have made the claim numerous times that no one knows , they only have unsubstantiated beliefs .
Heck, there is no proof of even the existence on ANY god or gods . Only a belief or lack of belief .
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15 Sep 19
@caissad4 saidI feel compelled to highlight that this thread’s OP is not seeking a metaphysical truth, it is seeking honesty and principled posting from three of the hellfire and eternal suffering protagonists in this forum.
I believe you are correct on this one.
I have made the claim numerous times that no one knows , they only have unsubstantiated beliefs .
Heck, there is no proof of even the existence on ANY god or gods . Only a belief or lack of belief .
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15 Sep 19
@hakima saidYes, yes, fictional deities of a female persuasion deserve to be capitalized too.
...but what about the female ones?
Athena, loved Her style.