Spirituality
25 Oct 21
@kellyjay saidI think you are mistaken in your use of the the following:.. 'word' v 'Word'. These are two different things
Your opinion about an unknown church is meaningless I am sharing scriptures with you not quoting church doctrine. If you wish to refute what I have said then show me how the scripture I have shared does not validate the things that I have shared. You have an issue not with me but the Word so demeaning me and the church I attend is meaningless it is the Word that matters not our opinions of it.
- the word of God is the scriptures
- the Word of God is Jesus Christ.
I have produced the Gospel of the Word of God aka Jesus Christ
You have produced the gospel taken from the scriptures' or the word of God.
As Peter stated and so many other places in the bible, Jesus Christ has the words of eternal life. The scriptures do not have eternal life. You are mistaken
In any case this is my final post on the matter. You stay with what you believe to be true and I will do the same.
05 Nov 21
@rajk999 saidYou have issues with both however you choose to look at them.
I think you are mistaken in your use of the the following:.. 'word' v 'Word'. These are two different things
- the word of God is the scriptures
- the Word of God is Jesus Christ.
I have produced the Gospel of the Word of God aka Jesus Christ
You have produced the gospel taken from the scriptures' or the word of God.
As Peter stated and so many other places in the b ...[text shortened]... is is my final post on the matter. You stay with what you believe to be true and I will do the same.
@kellyjay saidThanks for your opinion which I value as much as I value your opinion on these other matters:
You have issues with both however you choose to look at them.
1. Christians go to heaven when they die
2. NonChristians are tortured for eternity
3. Angels have wings
4. Nobody can be righteous unless they believe in Christ
5. All people are filthy sinners
6. Jesus is God and equal to God
@rajk999 saidYou do not even know what I believe looking at your list.
Thanks for your opinion which I value as much as I value your opinion on these other matters:
1. Christians go to heaven when they die
2. NonChristians are tortured for eternity
3. Angels have wings
4. Nobody can be righteous unless they believe in Christ
5. All people are filthy sinners
6. Jesus is God and equal to God
06 Nov 21
@rajk999 saidOnly one I would say I agree with as written, one I have no idea where you got the idea for it, and the rest would need to be clarified.
Thanks for your opinion which I value as much as I value your opinion on these other matters:
1. Christians go to heaven when they die
2. NonChristians are tortured for eternity
3. Angels have wings
4. Nobody can be righteous unless they believe in Christ
5. All people are filthy sinners
6. Jesus is God and equal to God
The one I agree with as written, "All people are filthy sinners"
Simply put, because experience and scriptures say so.
In Romans, it says,
For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”
“Their throat is an open grave;
they use their tongues to deceive.”
“The venom of asps is under their lips.”
“Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.”
“Their feet are swift to shed blood;
in their paths are ruin and misery,
and the way of peace they have not known.”
“There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
I guess you have some means to refute this scripture; if not, your doctrine goes against the Word. How do you justify someone with no fear of God, how do you justify someone who denies Jesus, how do you justify someone ignoring the great salvation offered to us? Hebrews has some strongly worded warnings about that.
Hebrews
Therefore we must pay much closer attention to what we have heard, lest we drift away from it. For since the message declared by angels proved to be reliable, and every transgression or disobedience received a just retribution, how shall we escape if we neglect such a great salvation? It was declared at first by the Lord, and it was attested to us by those who heard, while God also bore witness by signs and wonders and various miracles and by gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to his will.
Matthew has something Jesus says about those that deny Him.
So everyone who acknowledges me before men, I also will acknowledge before my Father who is in heaven, but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven.
Jesus speaking in John says who gets eternal life; as an aside, it doesn't say Christian here.
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
A little later, Jesus says this,
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
People can be condemned already; why?
How do you answer these? I assume you have answers unless you are only going to attack the church I go to again as if you even knew the denomination I belong to or me personally. I'm giving you scriptural reasons; you should at least be able to show why I'm wrong; if not, I believe that would be telling.
@kellyjay saidWell here are the options
Only one I would say I agree with as written, one I have no idea where you got the idea for it, and the rest would need to be clarified.
The one I agree with as written, "All people are filthy sinners"
Simply put, because experience and scriptures say so.
In Romans, it says,
For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, as it is written: ...[text shortened]... reasons; you should at least be able to show why I'm wrong; if not, I believe that would be telling.
- Paul is wrong.
- You have misinterpreted Paul.
How do i know that? Jesus said nothing of the sort. In any event, I have already established your gospel is nonsense
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For me personally, I promote and believe in the Gospel message taught by Jesus Christ and preached by the disciples.
Discussion over.
You don't even believe Christ physically rose from the dead.
Why don't you make statements proving me wrong about you NOT preaching the
bodily resurrection of Christ as the apostles and gospel writers did?
It should be easy for you to totally embarrasses me and force me to retract my words. But I don't see you believing such a cardinal tenet of the teaching of Jesus and His apostles on this.
"And why they still did not believer for joy and were marveling, He said to them, Do you have anything here to eat? And they handed Him a piece of broiled fish; And He took it AND ATE BEFORE THEM.
And He said to them, These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all the things written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and Psalms concerning Me must be fulfilled. Then He opened their mind to understand the Scriptures."
It would be wonderful if you were to have YOUR mind opened to understand the Scriptures, both the OT and the NT about the true Gospel you profess to teach but apparently do not believe.
"And He said to them, Thus it is written that the Christ would suffer and RISE UP FROM THE DEAD on the third day, and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.
You are witnesses of these things." (See Luke 24: 41-48)
Acts proves that the first church in Jerusalem starting with Peter and the apostles proclaimed the death AND RESURRECTION bodily, physically of the Lord Jesus was the cornerstone of their message.
It seems your mission in life is to oppose the New Testament and with stealth contradict it.
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@Suzianne
The way Rajk999 spoke to you was more like an angry and bitter closet Muslim.
It was embarrassing.
I wondered where was Paul's exhortation that a mature Christian worker like Timothy should entreat the women disciples as sisters or mothers.
" . . . but exhort . . . elderly women as mothers, younger women as sisters, in all purity." (refer 1 Tim. 5:1,2)
06 Nov 21
@rajk999 saidI'm quoting you as you tell me what I believe.
No. I said Jesus said nothing of the sort.
To prove Im wrong is pretty easy.
Quote the references where Jesus said -
... "All people are filthy sinners"
You said this.
."All people are filthy sinners"
Everyone is a sinner. Now you believe there are pretty sinners, clean sinners, just and honorable sinners, or do you believe sin is wrong, it leads to death, that it goes against God and man?
John 8:34
Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin.
Acts 2:38
And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Romans 5:1
Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Romans 5:20-21
Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Galatians 3:22
But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
1 Timothy 1:15
The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost.
The good news, the Gospel is Jesus has come into the world to save sinners. He even said He didn't come for the righteous but those that needed Him. Why would anyone who didn't sin need to be forgiven, why would there be a need for a Savior if we could earn our way to God by working for it?
Mark 2:17
And when Jesus heard it, he said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.”
The good news, God came to save us, not condemn us, but those that reject that reject the salvation that the Lord God brings in Christ Jesus. Jesus said in the book of John that,"... everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” To deny you need to be saved, to deny you have sinned suggests you don't require God's grace for sin in Jesus Christ also suggests such things. You either own your guilt and come to God for forgiveness that was won for you by Jesus Christ, or you don't.
06 Nov 21
@kellyjay saidGreat, so Jesus never said ... all people are filthy sinners ...
I'm quoting you as you tell me what I believe.
You said this.
."All people are filthy sinners"
Everyone is a sinner. Now you believe there are pretty sinners, clean sinners, just and honorable sinners, or do you believe sin is wrong, it leads to death, that it goes against God and man?
John 8:34
Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who pract ...[text shortened]... r own your guilt and come to God for forgiveness that was won for you by Jesus Christ, or you don't.
But YOU said The one I agree with as written, "All people are filthy sinners"
Simply put, because experience and scriptures say so.
So the scriptures say so, but Jesus did not say that.
I got it.
06 Nov 21
@rajk999 saidI agree that all of us are sinners,
Great, so Jesus never said ... all people are filthy sinners ...
But YOU said The one I agree with as written, "All people are filthy sinners"
Simply put, because experience and scriptures say so.
So the scriptures say so, but Jesus did not say that.
I got it.
I agree all sin is filthy.
I agree with the statement YOU made about me that I believe that.
I was following your statement that I agree with it; if you want to push that into another context, it is meaningless and has nothing to do with the context I was commenting about when I responded.
06 Nov 21
@kellyjay saidWhat about the going to heaven doctrine. You dont believe that anymore?
I agree that all of us are sinners,
I agree all sin is filthy.
I agree with the statement YOU made about me that I believe that.
I was following your statement that I agree with it; if you want to push that into another context, it is meaningless and has nothing to do with the context I was commenting about when I responded.