Truth .. JW Style

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
well now that you now what are you going to do about it? it is after all, as you have stated a matter of life and death? and actually you have stated now, perhaps three or four times, both publicly and privately that you have no intention of ever joining that 'stupid cult', in becoming a Jehovahs Witness, did you not? are we now to presume that yo ...[text shortened]... t it was not good enough for you. I reject you accusations of self righteousness and conceit!

No, your response wasn't good enough as it was incorrect and serious error in terms of your own organisations doctrine.

Perhaps all the JWs here should open their eyes a little, read up on what your cult actually stands for and make a revised decision on whether you hold all truth or not. At one point Galv actually said no you don't have to be a JW member, then retracted it (probably on advice from you) then went on to say he didn't know - it's ludicrous you guys don't even know the basics of your own organisations rules.


(btw I don't believe I called your cult "stupid". I stand to be corrected if you can show I did).

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.

We teach people how to live, not in some fairy tale of an afterlife. Your way out on this one Agers, way out. Its the application of Biblical principles in a very real way that shall help someone overcome all manner of ill. If a doctor prescribes ...[text shortened]... medication and you refuse to take it, where does the responsibility lay, with you or the doctor?

Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.
No good if the hungry student lacks the strength to hold the damned fishing rod!

We teach people how to live, not in some fairy tale of an afterlife. Your way out on this one Agers, way out. Its the application of Biblical principles in a very real way that shall help someone overcome all manner of ill. If a doctor prescribes a course of medication and you refuse to take it, where does the responsibility lay, with you or the doctor?
Could you be specific...suppose you, a JW, encounter me on the street; the only thing I've eaten in 3 days is a Twix and I'm a gibbering mess desperate for drugs. Are you just going to tell me how to live my life in accordance with the Bible and then wait for a miraculous transformation in me?...I need food & drugs dammit !! and I need them NOW!!!...not some bloody lecture about how to live like Jesus!!!

Originally posted by Agerg
[b]Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.
No good if the hungry student lacks the strength to hold the damned fishing rod!

We teach people how to live, not in some fairy tale of an afterlife. Your way out on this one Agers, way out. Its the application of Biblical principles in a very re ugs dammit !! and I need them NOW!!!...not some bloody lecture about how to live like Jesus!!!

Is there going to be some point here that possibly, maybe or even by accident that you guys might actually read our postings and see what we're actually saying? I've never seen such a group of people that apparently have no concept of simple explinations that YES...we do help millions of people earthwide with material issues when it is needed. Read that line a few more times if it will help for that to sink in!!!!!
And don't be so foolish with your example of you needing food. Of course any JW would go out of his way to help you, my gosh.

Originally posted by Conrau K
[b]hundreds of different Christians preaching and evangelising, pure bum, never met one in my life and I live next to two Catholic schools, Holy family primary and St. Ninians secondary.

Ok. Then you will have to explain why your Australian counterparts are so apathetic.

All i ever get is a wee leaflet about Easter popped through the door, Ca ...[text shortened]... rict sense, the expounding of Scripture on behalf of the Church, is only permissible to clergy.

Oh yes Conrau, your idea of doing the preaching work is so much better then what Jesus said to do. I never thought of that or did Jesus. How foolish he must have been to think just going from door to door where you could actually sit down one on one and teach them, listen to their questions directly and show them from there own Bible what is actually said in the Bible would not work. How stupid of us to think that is not the right way and your way is so, so superior!!!!!!
You know you should srart you own religion and put that great idea into motion..
OH wait. That does happen everyday with ones who think they know more the God and what he says as well as direction from his son Jesus.
And besides you don't believe in God so that would be silly.

Originally posted by galveston75
Is there going to be some point here that possibly, maybe or even by accident that you guys might actually read our postings and see what we're actually saying? I've never seen such a group of people that apparently have no concept of simple explinations that YES...we do help millions of people earthwide with material issues when it is needed. Read that r example of you needing food. Of course any JW would go out of his way to help you, my gosh.

Well robbie carrobie's pot shots at those who hand out soup and his insistence that teaching biblical principles is the only way to overcome life's ills is in conflict with what you say here.

If you do indeed help in a pragmatic way, I have no way to infer this from what your comrade posts.

Originally posted by Agerg
Well robbie carrobie's pot shots at those who hand out soup and his insistence that teaching biblical principles is the only way to overcome life's ills is in conflict with what you say here.

If you do indeed help in a pragmatic way, I have no way to infer this from what your comrade posts.

The only reason he says that is because some here think that's all is needed to fulfill their role in being a Christian. It is a good thing and a needed thing for sure. But it seems they take that so seriously and just blow off the other commands we're told to do.
The feeding of ones that need it is great for a temporary life sustaining fix. But again lets all get busy with the other command Jesus said to do which will hopefully guarenty them life forwever.
Do you not see the wisdom in what Jesus is telling us to do?

Originally posted by galveston75
The only reason he says that is because some here think that's all is needed to fulfill their role in being a Christian. It is a good thing and a needed thing for sure. But it seems they take that so seriously and just blow off the other commands we're told to do.
The feeding of ones that need it is great for a temporary life sustaining fix. But again ...[text shortened]... ly guarenty them life forwever.
Do you not see the wisdom in what Jesus is telling us to do?

Well as an atheist I see great virtue in the efforts of Christians to feed the hungry, clothe the unclothed etc...things that are useful in the humanitarian sense. As for the other stuff, it is meaningless to me. So I'd have to say I don't see the wisdom in all you believe Jesus tells you to do.

Originally posted by Agerg
Well as an atheist I see great virtue in the efforts of Christians to feed the hungry, clothe the unclothed etc...things that are useful in the humanitarian sense. As for the other stuff, it is meaningless to me. So I'd have to say I don't see the wisdom in all you believe Jesus tells you to do.

Ok..Well thanks for you explination.

Originally posted by galveston75
The only reason he says that is because some here think that's all is needed to fulfill their role in being a Christian. It is a good thing and a needed thing for sure. But it seems they take that so seriously and just blow off the other commands we're told to do.
The feeding of ones that need it is great for a temporary life sustaining fix. But again ...[text shortened]... ly guarenty them life forwever.
Do you not see the wisdom in what Jesus is telling us to do?

actually the problem is quite the opposite; you insist that no other denomination or church is doing the work that Christ commanded (i.e. preaching the gospel). That is blatantly false. I have given proof over and over here in the forums that others (including mine) do preach the word, you refuse to accept that fact, I suspect, because it makes you feel less special, and in some way shines some light on the dishonesty of the Watchtower. That is your cross to bare, and you will answer for it, not me.

Originally posted by galveston75
Oh yes Conrau, your idea of doing the preaching work is so much better then what Jesus said to do. I never thought of that or did Jesus. How foolish he must have been to think just going from door to door where you could actually sit down one on one and teach them, listen to their questions directly and show them from there own Bible what is actually sai ...[text shortened]... as direction from his son Jesus.
And besides you don't believe in God so that would be silly.

I might be an atheist but that does not prevent me from engaging in exegesis. Looking at Scripture, I do not find Jesus specifically commanding all his disciples to preach. Jesus certainly commissions the apostles for this task (Luke 24:47). The gift of the Holy Spirit is first granted to them, not the numerous other disciples, for the conversion of Jerusalem (Acts 2). They specifically assume ministry of the world (Acts 6:4) and delegate administrative roles to others. We also know that in the early church some Christians had a special preaching role, such as Philip (Acts 21:8). Some Christians however clearly did not have this role. Acts several times mentions widows and women who lived simply praying. Paul himself explains,

28 And God indeed has set some in the church; first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly doctors: after that miracles: then the graces of healings, helps, governments, kinds of tongues, interpretations of speeches. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all doctors? 30 Are all workers of miracles? Have all the grace of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret? 1Corinthians 12:28-31.

The message behind this is that, while each is a member of the body of Christ, that does not mean that they are the same member. The hand is not foot. Some have the necessary gifts of ministry, others are suited to different roles. I do not see how an individual duty to preach at people's doorsteps is consistent with this. Even fiercely evangelical Christian groups have recognised that not all are called, or gifted, for such a task.

Originally posted by duecer
actually the problem is quite the opposite; you insist that no other denomination or church is doing the work that Christ commanded (i.e. preaching the gospel). That is blatantly false. I have given proof over and over here in the forums that others (including mine) do preach the word, you refuse to accept that fact, I suspect, because it makes you feel less ...[text shortened]... he dishonesty of the Watchtower. That is your cross to bare, and you will answer for it, not me.

And exactly how is this accomplished? Is door to door as Jesus and the apostles did?

Originally posted by Conrau K
I might be an atheist but that does not prevent me from engaging in exegesis. Looking at Scripture, I do not find Jesus specifically commanding all his disciples to preach. Jesus certainly commissions the apostles for this task (Luke 24:47). The gift of the Holy Spirit is first granted to them, not the numerous other disciples, for the conversion of Jerusal ...[text shortened]... angelical Christian groups have recognised that not all are called, or gifted, for such a task.

Of course you don't see it. It's obvious. Could you explain the events in Acts 1: 12-18 for me?

Originally posted by galveston75
Of course you don't see it. It's obvious. Could you explain the events in Acts 1: 12-18 for me?

How condescending. Why don't you respond to the Scripture I quoted? As always, whenever confronted with a good argument, the JW shirks away and uses any evasive tactic to conceal the fact he has no counter-argument.

As for Acts 1:12-18, I do not see what could possibly need interpretation. The apostles return to Jerusalem and then Peter explains how the Scripture has been fulfilled and Judas has died. Perhaps from here on, you can do the interpretive work. I do not see why I should have to interpret Scripture on your behalf for your argument.

Originally posted by galveston75
And exactly how is this accomplished? Is door to door as Jesus and the apostles did?

sometimes, and sometimes its at work, and sometimes while watching your kids play soccer, and sometimes its in the parking lot of a grocery store. One must take every opportunity provided. Christ never limited it to door to door, and btw that is a poor exegetical rendering of the passage, JW leaders would know this if they believed in higher education.

Originally posted by Conrau K
How condescending. Why don't you respond to the Scripture I quoted? As always, whenever confronted with a good argument, the JW shirks away and uses any evasive tactic to conceal the fact he has no counter-argument.

As for Acts 1:12-18, I do not see what could possibly need interpretation. The apostles return to Jerusalem and then Peter explains how the ...[text shortened]... e work. I do not see why I should have to interpret Scripture on your behalf for your argument.

Sorry my misprint. I meant thru the end of the chapter. Try to get the meaning and direction of the preaching work that was being done by diciples not just the apostles.