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What Does One Need to Know...

What Does One Need to Know...

Spirituality

diver

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Originally posted by @kellyjay
I laid out a case you can disagree and discuss or nit pick without really addressing the key points. If all you are going to do is express your disapproval you don’t need any response from me.
Where have you “laid out a case”...which page, which posts?

R
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Originally posted by @divegeester
You’re running away from his point, stand up to it and argue your case man.
Will you stand with me, Bronwen?

R
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Originally posted by @divegeester
Where have you “laid out a case”...which page, which posts?
You’re back to your boozy belligerence. Give it a rest, tiger.

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @fmf
Does "the universe" constitute evidence that supports the claims that other religions make about there being a creator?
Let the other religions speak for themselves, I will defend my beliefs, they can defend theirs.

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @wolfgang59
But rocks can be, and are, dated to see how old they are.
They are all different ages.

Why would scientists bother dating rocks if they thought your "logic" was sufficient?
Nobody (at least nobody sensible) says rocks must be billions of years old because the Earth is.
Who is going to prove the dates we apply wrong no matter the dates applied to them?
What we do know and agree with I believe is that we don't see any rocks that are dated
as eternal in any of our tests.

So going back to my argument from earlier there are two things I also believe true.
1st you only get nothing from nothing since there isn't anything to change.
2nd there isn't anything that wasn't here before that just created itself by itself.

This leaves that the universe has to have been made by something outside of itself.
The dates can be argued having it here in my opinion shows evidence for God.

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @divegeester
Where have you “laid out a case”...which page, which posts?
Page 3 my last post on that page.

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Originally posted by @divegeester
Nobody is doubting the sincerity of your belief; the point here is that sincerity of belief is not evidence of anything other that the person with the sincere belief, and even then, if they apply rationality, they should see that their own sincerity is not evidence.
Bedtime, pal.

Time to put your noggin on the pillow and saw some logs. You had a long night at the pub.

I put some aspirin on your nightstand for when you wake up and your head feels like a throbbing cotton ball and your tongue like a Persian rug.

diver

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Originally posted by @kellyjay
Page 3 my last post on that page.
But that is not a “case”, it is not evidence of anything, it is just your opinion. In fact you actually call it your “opinion” twice in your first paragraph.

You need to recognise the difference between your opinions, your beliefs and actual evidence.

F

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Originally posted by @kellyjay
Let the other religions speak for themselves, I will defend my beliefs, they can defend theirs.
Don't be obtuse. Does "the universe" constitute evidence that supports the claims that other religions make about there being a creator ~ whether you believe that "evidence" or not?

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @fmf
Don't be obtuse. Does "the universe" constitute evidence that supports the claims that other religions make about there being a creator ~ whether you believe that "evidence" or not?
You want to make the argument for other's beliefs do so, I'm not going to.

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @divegeester
But that is not a “case”, it is not evidence of anything, it is just your opinion. In fact you actually call it your “opinion” twice in your first paragraph.

You need to recognise the difference between your opinions, your beliefs and actual evidence.
Our opinions state what we think and why, we look around us and see things that matter
to us. We can state we believe this due to that, it is unescapable since we are going to
be trusting somethings true or not. We don’t trust everything that we are presented with
as factual, or that it proves what others suggest. We must make up our minds to either
reject something as meaningful or accept it, but it is always going to be based upon our
opinions.

F

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Originally posted by @kellyjay
You want to make the argument for other's beliefs do so, I'm not going to.
Do you believe that 'creation' is only "evidence" for Christian belief in a creator?

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @fmf
Do you believe that 'creation' is only "evidence" for Christian belief in a creator?
Creation is an act not evidence, the universe is the evidence which I believe points to
creation, and since I'm a Christian I think it is plain that I believe the God of Abraham, Isaac,
and Jacob did it.

diver

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Originally posted by @kellyjay
We must make up our minds to either reject something as meaningful or accept it, but it is always going to be based upon our opinions.
I completely agree, it is entirely based on opinion.

Opinion is not fact, opinion is not evidence, do you agree?

KellyJay
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Originally posted by @divegeester
I completely agree, it is entirely based on opinion.

Opinion is not fact, opinion is not evidence, do you agree?
Correct, our opinions look at what is around us and we either accept or reject this means
that, or it proves this, or it means something else, and disproves that. Which is why I
stated the two reasons I believe the universe is evidence for God, again only nothing
comes from nothing that is all that will ever happen there, and there isn't anything that
can create itself out of nothing.

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