13 Apr 21
@divegeester said@sonship
An open question then...
If there is such a thing as the trinity, then which part or parts of the trinity became flesh?
Would you care to comment on this question?
13 Apr 21
@divegeester saidGood question. I can bet the answer will be a bunch of mumbo jumbo followed by the claim that it is mysterious and experiential but nobody can understand it.
An open question then...
If there is such a thing as the trinity, then which part or parts of the trinity became flesh?
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13 Apr 21
@divegeester saidWhen I get a span of time to concentrate I will post something on this question.
@sonship
Would you care to comment on this question?
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If there is such a thing as the trinity, then which part or parts of the trinity became flesh?
Take the statements of the Bible to be your guide on this matter of incarnation.
"For in Him [Christ] all the fullness was pleased to dwell" (Col. 1:19)
It did not say one third of the fullness was pleased to dwell.
It did not say 33.333333% of the fullness was pleased to dwell.
"All the fullness" was pleased to dwell in Christ the Son of God.
Again:
"For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily." (Col. 2:9)
It doesn't say 1/3 of the fullness of the Godhead dwells in Him bodily and 2/3 dwells outside of Him.
You ask "Which part?" My reply would be "all the fullness" dwelt and dwells in Christ bodily.
I cannot understand it as 2/3 of the fullness was not pleased to dwell in Christ bodily but 1/3 was.
@sonship saidHow does that all 100% fullness translate into power, authority and knowledge. The very same bible also says:
@divegeester
If there is such a thing as the trinity, then which part or parts of the trinity became flesh?
Take the statements of the Bible to be your guide on this matter of incarnation.
"For in Him [Christ] all the fullness was pleased to dwell" (Col. 1:19)
It did not say one third of the fullness was pleased to dwell. ...[text shortened]... I cannot understand it as 2/3 of the fullness was not pleased to dwell in Christ bodily but 1/3 was.
- God is Greater than Christ
- God is the Head of Christ
- Christ prays to God and not the other way around
- God knows more than Christ
- God is the Father and Christ is the Son
- Christ is between God and man as he is the mediator.
There is no equality. How is that 100% anything.
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13 Apr 21
How does that all 100% fullness translate into power, authority and knowledge. The very same bible also says:
- God is Greater than Christ
It says both.
I believe both.
God whom I trust has told us both.
- God is the Head of Christ
The word of God says both things.
I believe both.
I refuse to choose one to believe in order to disbelieve the other.
My God whom I trust has told us both.
- Christ prays to God and not the other way around[ /quote]
After reading about Jesus praying to the Father the verses of
Col. 1:19 and Col.2:9 did not suddenly disappear from the Bible.
I reserve the right to believe ALL that the Bible has taught.
It has taught both the praying of Jesus to the Father and that the fullness of the Godhead dwells in Him bodily.
I refuse to use one verse to suppress the other.
I refuse to use the other verse to suppress the one.
I trust God has told the truth in telling us BOTH.
[quote]
- God knows more than Christ
After examining that Christ said such a thing while on earth Col. 1:17 and 2:9
did not suddenly vanish from the Holy Bible.
I accept both, trust both, and say AMEN! to both.
- God is the Father and Christ is the Son
Colossians said "God our Father" (1:1) and it also said "Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" 1:3[b] and also said [b]"the Son of His love" (1:13).
I believe both.
I teach new believers to believe both.
I teach those seeking God to believe both.
I say "AMEN!" to both and I say AMEN! to all the fullness dwelling in Christ bodily as the fullness was pleased to do so (Col.1:19;2:9)
- Christ is between God and man as he is the mediator.
I believe both that "there is God and one Mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus" (1 Tim. 2:5) AND I believe "all the fullness of the Godhead" dwells and was pleased to dwell in Christ [b](Col. 1:17;2:9)
My God whom I trust has uttered both and I trust both are true.
There is no equality. How is that 100% anything.
I cannot exhaustively explain the Triune God to anyone.
I advise anyone to receive Christ and trust whatever the word of God has said.
@sonship saidIf both are stated in the bible then the issue is indeterminate and firm conclusions cannot be made. Therefore the wise Christian will refrain from doing several things to avoid going off on a tangent and venturing into false doctrines such as:
It says both.
I believe both.
God whom I trust has told us both.
- God is the Head of Christ
The word of God says both things.
- calling the whole thing a Trinity in which all three parts of the Godhead are equal and eternal
- claiming superiority over others who do not believe in the Trinity
- renaming Trinity, and calling it Triune God and believing that makes a difference.
- telling others that a belief in the Trinity / Triune God is necessary for eternal life.
In fact this has to be the first time you have admitted that the issue is not clear in the bible.
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13 Apr 21
1 edit
If both are stated in the bible then the issue is indeterminate and firm conclusions cannot be made.
An eternally FIRM conclusion can be made by receiving Christ through faith.
"As many as received Him to them He gave authority to become children of God."
Therefore the wise Christian will refrain from doing several things to avoid going off on a tangent and venturing into false doctrines such as:
The wise Christian will hold fast the Head Christ and not be distracted from fellowshipping with Christ and enjoying Christ.
- calling the whole thing a Trinity in which all three parts of the Godhead are equal and eternal
The wise Christian will receive the statements of the Bible.
The wise Christian will trust in the power of God rather than the wisdom of men.
- claiming superiority over others who do not believe in the Trinity
And one needs Christ to live that way.
So this only proves my point.
The wise Christian will also not be led away from the enjoyment of Christ by
anyone's philosophy. Read Colossians sometime.
" Beware that no one carries you off as spoil through his philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the elements of the world, and not according to Christ;
For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily." (Col. 2;8,9)
13 Apr 21
@sonship saidOk you are venturing into nonsense talk again. Clearly your ability to focus is short-lived. Carry on.
@Rajk999
If both are stated in the bible then the issue is indeterminate and firm conclusions cannot be made.
An eternally FIRM conclusion can be made by receiving Christ through faith.
"As many as received Him to them He gave authority to become children of God."
[quote]
Therefore the wise Christian will refrain from doing several things ...[text shortened]... according to Christ;
For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily." (Col. 2;8,9)[/b]
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13 Apr 21
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@Rajk999
When you receive the Triune God you cannot make any experiential distinction between the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit.
The terms are used interchangeably to the Christ EXPERIENCING Romans to whom Paul wrote:
"But you are not in the flesh, but in the spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Yet if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not of Him. But if Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, the spirit is life because of righteousness. And if the Spirit of the One who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who indwells you." (Rom. 8:9-11)
The Spirit of God is used interchangeably with the Spirit of Christ.
And the Spirit of Christ is used interchangeably with Christ.
And Christ is used interchangeably with the Spirit of the One who raised Jesus from the dead."
Seamlessly, practically in one breath Paul interchanges the titles proving that the One who dwells in the Christians is the Father - the Son - the Holy Spirit as divine life.
Likewise, Christ, in Romans 8, is in two locations.
Christ is at the right hand of God interceding for the believers (Rom. 8:34).
Yet Christ is also dwelling in the believers (v. 10).
The triune God is mysterious yet real.
Furthermore, Christ is at the right hand of God interceding (v.34).
But the Holy Spirit is the one within the believers interceding for them (v.26)
.
The way of richest blessing is to say "AMEN!" to whatever the word of God has told us.
@sonship saidSo can I get you to be clear please, you are saying that all 3 distinct persons of Father, Son and Holy Spirit dwelt within the Son, Jesus?
@divegeester
Take the statements of the Bible to be your guide on this matter of incarnation.
"For in Him [Christ] all the fullness was pleased to dwell" (Col. 1:19)
It did not say one third of the fullness was pleased to dwell. I cannot understand it as 2/3 of the fullness was not pleased to dwell in Christ bodily but 1/3 was.
14 Apr 21
@divegeester saidAnd what do you think you get if you "win"?
So can I get you to be clear please, you are saying that all 3 distinct persons of Father, Son and Holy Spirit dwelt within the Son, Jesus?