23 May 07
Or does the left only scream about Paleo refugee camps getting hit when its the Israelis doing it?
http://yalibnan.com/site/archives/2007/05/terrorists_usin.php
The Lebanese are pounding a Paleo camp and nobody here has said a word. I find it hard to believe that you would be silent if the Joos were doing this exact same thing.
What say you? Would any of you that call yourself pro-Palestinian at least like to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?
23 May 07
Originally posted by MerkI was wondering the same thing!
Or does the left only scream about Paleo refugee camps getting hit when its the Israelis doing it?
http://yalibnan.com/site/archives/2007/05/terrorists_usin.php
The Lebanese are pounding a Paleo camp and nobody here has said a word. I find it hard to believe that you would be silent if the Joos were doing this exact same thing.
What say you? Would any ...[text shortened]... to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?
23 May 07
1 edit
I think Lebanon has learned by now that if it doesn't put on a good show of carnage and massacre for Israel, then Israel will start bombing Lebanon just for kicks. One should recall the pretext for Israel's last savage thrust into Lebanon less than a year ago. You know, the claim that Lebanon wasn't doing enough against Hezbollah etc. etc. That claim.
23 May 07
5 edits
I think a lot of such comments have to do with those who criticize Muslims who cause 'collateral damage' yet do not criticise Israelis for the same thing. People aren't going after Lebanon because Lebanon doesn't have half the US condoning its every action. There's no one to argue with about this.
This is also taking place on Lebanese soil and the firefight was initiated by the enemies of the Lebanese. Usually the criticisms of Israel are about civilian casualties somewhere other than Israel itself, right? Can you recall any time in which Israel was criticised for shooting back at enemies who are on Israeli soil and who fired first?
AND the PLO, the "sole legitimate representative of the Palestinian People" according to the Arab League, Israel and the UN, is backing the Lebanese Army.
23 May 07
Originally posted by Merk"Mainstream Sunni Muslim leaders, clerics and politicians threw their support behind the army, as did Palestine Liberation Organization representative in Lebanon Abbas Zaki." That's why.
What say you? Would any of you that call yourself pro-Palestinian at least like to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?
23 May 07
Originally posted by Bosse de NageSo its okay to kill paleo civilians as long as other Muslims support it?
"Mainstream Sunni Muslim leaders, clerics and politicians threw their support behind the army, as did Palestine Liberation Organization representative in Lebanon Abbas Zaki." That's why.
23 May 07
Originally posted by MerkThat isn't really what they are saying...spin-doctor Merk...
So its okay to kill paleo civilians as long as other Muslims support it?
"The Palestinian Liberation Organization and the Palestinian factions' union delegation to the Grand Serail stressed Palestinians should shoulder responsibility for the improvised action by Fatah al-Islam. The delegation comprised representatives from Hamas, The Democratic Front, Sa'iqa, The Nidal Front, Islamic Jihad, Fatah al-Intifada, The Palestinian Liberation Front and Abbas Zaki, the representative of the executive committee of the PLO"
The Lebanese army has been accused of using excessive force. That's probably true. They've got a long way to go before they catch up with Israel, though...Body count disparities aside, they need to start attacking refugee camps in foreign countries.
ATY made some good points you haven't responded to.
23 May 07
1 edit
Originally posted by Bosse de NageI try to make it a habit of not responding. I didn't think the point was relevant anyway. It would be if I was asking if the Lebanese were equal to the Isaelis, but I'm not.
That isn't really what they are saying...spin-doctor Merk...
"The Palestinian Liberation Organization and the Palestinian factions' union delegation to the Grand Serail stressed Palestinians should [b]shoulder responsibility for the improvised action by Fatah al-Islam. The delegation comprised representatives from Hamas, The Democratic Front, Sa ugee camps in foreign countries.
ATY made some good points you haven't responded to.[/b]
The complaint has been about the Jews being so heavy handed that they kill inncocent Paleos. Now here we are, with the Lebanese doing exactly that, and people aren't saying a peep.
Edit: How am I spin-doctoring? Your post clearly implied that because the local Muslim groups support it, everyone is mum.
23 May 07
Originally posted by Merk"Would any of you that call yourself pro-Palestinian at least like to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?" Plus, your post implies that Palestinian refugees are the army's target--which is plainly false. So, that's the way you spin, spin, spin, Merk. You're as bad as Shavixmir. Maybe worse--because you're better at it.
I try to make it a habit of not responding. I didn't think the point was relevant anyway. It would be if I was asking if the Lebanese were equal to the Isaelis, but I'm not.
The complaint has been about the Jews being so heavy handed that they kill inncocent Paleos. Now here we are, with the Lebanese doing exactly that, and people aren't saying a peep.
...[text shortened]... ? Your post clearly implied that because the local Muslim groups support it, everyone is mum.
The first I heard about this story was when you brought it up here. Strangely enough, a lot of stories surface here before they make the local news...
There aren't really enough facts to start making judgements yet, are there? It's unclear whether al-Fatah rejected a cease-fire or not. Still, the Red Cross managed to evacuate casualties. No stories about ambulances being bombed...unlike last year's events in Lebanon.
ATY's points still stand, since they address why this story hasn't kicked up as much fuss as you would like.
Surely you can do better than exploit the deaths of Palestinian refugees in an attempt to discredit RHP forum posters...? 🙂
23 May 07
1 edit
Originally posted by Bosse de Nage"Plus, your post implies that Palestinian refugees are the army's target--which is plainly false. So, that's the way you spin, spin, spin, Merk. You're as bad as Shavixmir. Maybe worse--because you're better at it."
"Would any of you that call yourself pro-Palestinian at least like to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?" Plus, your post implies that Palestinian refugees are the army's target--which is plainly false. So, that's the way you spin, spin, spin, Merk. You're as bad as Shavixmir. Maybe worse--becau he deaths of Palestinian refugees in an attempt to discredit RHP forum posters...? 🙂
I wasn't implying that the Paleos inncocents were the targets. That's an interpretation, which probably comes from a habit of interpreting Israeli actions as actions targetting civilians.
"The first I heard about this story was when you brought it up here. Strangely enough, a lot of stories surface here before they make the local news..."
It's not news in the states either. Don't you love how that works? A little time net scoping foreign news orgs will put a person a day or more ahead of the local news.
"There aren't really enough facts to start making judgements yet, are there? It's unclear whether al-Fatah rejected a cease-fire or not. Still, the Red Cross managed to evacuate casualties. "
Yes there is. Paleo refugees are beeing bombarded with arty.
"No stories about ambulances being bombed...unlike last year's events in Lebanon"
It's normal for ambulances in Palistan to haul gunnies and ammo. If you recall, during Paleo Civil War I, Hamas and Fatah would both not allow them into certain areas. If Israel hit one that was legit, we should at least be willing to consider that they didn't target it just because it was an ambulance.
"ATY's points still stand, since they address why this story hasn't kicked up as much fuss as you would like."
Oh please. The reason it's not stirring up fuss is because it's muzzie on muzzie. I'm sure I'm not the only one that notices that whenever Israel does something to the Arabs, it's all over, but whenever it's Arab on Arab, or muzzie on muzzie, it gets no press. Look at Sudan for example. Now imagine Israel doing that to Arabs. It would be all over the press.
"Surely you can do better than exploit the deaths of Palestinian refugees in an attempt to discredit RHP forum posters...?"
RHP posters discredit themselves well enough without me. I just thought it was interesting that nobody is standing up for the Paleo refugees on this one.
I mean, it's like they don't even know that Bush supports the Cedar Revolution. If they did, surely they would be wailing about the action of an American Lapdog Government™.
23 May 07
Originally posted by SoothfastI follow different ROEs with ATY than I do most other posters.
By and large, then, you forfeit every game. A curious tactic in a "debate forum", but perhaps understandable insofar as your political postures are demonstrably devoid of substance.
While I think she has a good head on her shoulders, we both tend to get on each others nerves and frustrate each other, so I try to engage as little as possible.
23 May 07
Originally posted by MerkPersonally I do not have a high opinion of any of the Arab leadership. But I don't feel as responsible and on this forum there are not many people advocating that Lebanon should bomb, so where's the debate?
Or does the left only scream about Paleo refugee camps getting hit when its the Israelis doing it?
http://yalibnan.com/site/archives/2007/05/terrorists_usin.php
The Lebanese are pounding a Paleo camp and nobody here has said a word. I find it hard to believe that you would be silent if the Joos were doing this exact same thing.
What say you? Would any ...[text shortened]... to pretend that you're not just wearing a pro-Palestinian mask to cover your anti-Israeli face?
The reason I complain more about the Israelis is simple. We in the west are very responsible for creating the state of Israel.
Its the same with the US, as a Brit I see the States as our natural Ally. So I want it to behave to a higher standard than other Countries. It should be a world leader in more than dropping bombs on peoples heads.
23 May 07
Originally posted by petrosianpupilWhy is nobody screeching about the Paleo civilians? Is it more about Israel or is more about Paleos?
Personally I do not have a high opinion of any of the Arab leadership. But I don't feel as responsible and on this forum there are not many people advocating that Lebanon should bomb, so where's the debate?
The reason I complain more about the Israelis is simple. We in the west are very responsible for creating the state of Israel.
Its the same ...[text shortened]... han other Countries. It should be a world leader in more than dropping bombs on peoples heads.