Death at the bottom of the ocean

@torunn said

If these two vessels had been manned only by people who had designed them and were willing to put their own lives at stake, I wouldn't mind

The man who designed Titanic was on board when it sank.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Andrews

The man who owned the cruise line was also onboard but he survived.

@divegeester said
The man who designed Titanic was on board when it sank.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Andrews

The man who owned the cruise line was also onboard but he survived.

I have read a lot about the Titanic and watched many documentaries, one of which quite recently raising new theories as to what caused the tragedy. The fact that the designer and the owner were onboard does not, in my opinion, change the fact that it was a construction that wasn't ready for passengers.

@torunn said
I have read a lot about the Titanic and watched many documentaries, one of which quite recently raising new theories as to what caused the tragedy. The fact that the designer and the owner were onboard does not, in my opinion, change the fact that it was a construction that wasn't ready for passengers.

Titanic sank because it was massively holed below the waterline by an iceberg. This could have happened to any ocean liner. Are you suggesting that all ocean liners at that time were “experimental”?

@divegeester said
Titanic sank because it was massively holed below the waterline by an iceberg. This could have happened to any ocean liner. Are you suggesting that all ocean liners at that time were “experimental”?

Titanic sank because of its wrong design - there were several flaws and construction mistakes, human errors also. It would not have happened to any other ocean liner.

@torunn said
Titanic sank because of its wrong design - there were several flaws and construction mistakes, human errors also. It would not have happened to any other ocean liner.

Nonsense; lots of ships have been lost due to then having iceberg collisions.

@divegeester said
Nonsense; lots of ships have been lost due to then having iceberg collisions.

That's right, but they were not designed the same way as Titanic and were not designed as unsinkable.

Edit: We are no ship designers or technicians - my conclusions are those I have had from several documentaries, some recent, and discussing it further wouldn't give anything.

@torunn said
That's right, but they were not designed the same way as Titanic and were not designed as unsinkable.

One could almost think you are suggesting that the Titanic, with its new design, was steered into an iceberg because they thought the ship was an experiment in unsinkability. But giving that impression is not deliberate on your part, right? It's certainly not how the story goes.

@fmf said
One could almost think you are suggesting that the Titanic, with its new design, was steered into an iceberg because they thought the ship was an experiment in unsinkability. But giving that impression is not deliberate on your part, right? It's certainly not how the story goes.

Of course not, it is not how the documentaries described it, but there were several reasons - design and construction - that might not have become obvious in such an unfortunate way, had it not been for the unthinkable: that the unsinkable ship sank.

@fmf said
One could almost think you are suggesting that the Titanic, with its new design, was steered into an iceberg because they thought the ship was an experiment in unsinkability. But giving that impression is not deliberate on your part, right? It's certainly not how the story goes.

I think you are alone in thinking that.

” We place absolute confidence in the Titanic. We believe the boat is unsinkable.”

White Star Line Vice President P.A.S. Franklin

@torunn said
Of course not, it is not how the documentaries described it, but there were several reasons - design and construction - that might not have become obvious in such an unfortunate way, had it not been for the unthinkable: that the unsinkable ship sank.

But the Titanic was not designed to withstand the type of damage that it sustained from its collision. So rather than being an experiment, I think it was just a good design undermined, catastrophically, by awful seamanship.

@fmf said
But the Titanic was not designed to withstand the type of damage that it sustained from its collision. So rather than being an experiment, I think it was just a good design undermined, catastrophically, by awful seamanship.

FMF, my understanding of the unfortunate tragedy is what I have from documentaries, recent and older, nothing to discuss.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
I think you are alone in thinking that.

I alone made the ironic comment, that much is true.

@torunn said
FMF, my understanding of the unfortunate tragedy is what I have from documentaries, recent and older, nothing to discuss.

nothing to discuss

That's a pity. I have found your take on this very interesting.

@fmf said
nothing to discuss

That's a pity. I have found your take on this very interesting.

I have said what I have learned, I don't want to speculate.

@torunn said
I have said what I have learned, I don't want to speculate.

OK, then. You have closed down the conversation. I will desist.