03 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by CartersonAnd I repeat that is not even computer science. Fritz does not plan. Each position after each move is evaluated separately. No plan, no long term vision, no intuition, nothing like a human thought process.
You just proved my point. he took those out because then statistically it would drive the numbers down because then the moves that followed could be explained more.
What part of that did you not get?
The one move in a series does not match Fritz's engine choice is chucked out, but the new position gets evaluated, and Fritz understands the plan and g ...[text shortened]... ht along with what he saw because they are forced moves.
I repeat that is not rocket science
Driving the numbers down is what you should be wanting. A low match up would favour your alter ego. High figures do not. If 60 moves had failed to match top three choices and been apparently discarded the total match up would have been approximately 52%. Completely unremarkable and no cause for suspicion.
Manage to get 100% total match up and the clamour for a ban would be deafening!
03 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by CartersonAll non-database moves are analyzed. After the moves are all analyzed and Fritz's first three choices on each recorded, the number of moves which matched Fritz's 1st, 2nd or 3rd choice are totalled.
You just proved my point. he took those out because then statistically it would drive the numbers down because then the moves that followed could be explained more.
What part of that did you not get?
The one move in a series does not match Fritz's engine choice is chucked out, but the new position gets evaluated, and Fritz understands the plan and g ...[text shortened]... ht along with what he saw because they are forced moves.
I repeat that is not rocket science
There's really no discretion by the person running the analysis; I let Fritz "think" for 60 seconds and then hit the command "copy to Notation". Nothing more, nothing less.
03 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderI give up. I have made a case that shows that this analysis is not perfect.
All non-database moves are analyzed. After the moves are all analyzed and Fritz's first three choices on each recorded, the number of moves which matched Fritz's 1st, 2nd or 3rd choice are totalled.
There's really no discretion by the person running the analysis; I let Fritz "think" for 60 seconds and then hit the command "copy to Notation". Nothing more, nothing less.
The people who know him can see exactly what happened here.
I mean when someone that is saying he was a cheat and believes in engine analysis does not know that even those come with a database then I feel like I am in that commercial with all of the monkeys.
I agree some high match up rates were there with "given" analysis, but I also know that those numbers can be played with to say whatever you want.
As Sarah MaClaughlan says, "It's easier to believe".
But in my country, it takes "beyond a shadow of a doubt" to put someone in prison. Oh yeah, that system has proved to be perfect too.
Human emotion plays a part in everything. And we all know you had a blatant agenda.
03 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by CartersonJust for the record, I have never said he (whoever "he" is) is, was or maybe a cheat. I haven't said he isn't either come to that. You might also like to ask around about my attitude to engine analysis as a cheat detection tool. You should soon get the idea that some people think I don't believe in it.
I give up. I have made a case that shows that this analysis is not perfect.
The people who know him can see exactly what happened here.
I mean when someone that is saying he was a cheat and believes in engine analysis does not know that even those come with a database then I feel like I am in that commercial with all of the monkeys.
I agree some h o.
Human emotion plays a part in everything. And we all know you had a blatant agenda.
My only purpose here is to point out that you are going in the WRONG direction. If you want to demonstrate someone was wrongly banned you need to produce figures that are LOWER not HIGHER. You also need to be talking to those who own the site, not the inmates of the assylum.
I should also point out that trying to convince no1marauder that what he does is flawed without any real evidence is doomed to failure. He has used his method many times and has no reason to think it is flawed. You need to produce some real evidence and even then I give you no better than a 10% chance of convincing him.
03 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by CartersonPerfection is not required or achievable. Nor is proof "beyond a shadow of a doubt". What is required here is "overwhelming" evidence sufficient to establish "beyond a reasonable doubt" that the person used an engine. That evaluation is made at RHP by the Site Admins, not me. They decision is clearly correct IMO based on what I know. No one has yet given me any reason to believe they erred.
I give up. I have made a case that shows that this analysis is not perfect.
The people who know him can see exactly what happened here.
I mean when someone that is saying he was a cheat and believes in engine analysis does not know that even those come with a database then I feel like I am in that commercial with all of the monkeys.
I agree some h o.
Human emotion plays a part in everything. And we all know you had a blatant agenda.
I already explained in this thread why I checked nmdavidb's games (on page 9). It's true I didn't particularly care for him, but absent the indications of engine use that I saw I wouldn't have bothered to run game analysis; it's just too time consuming if it's a wild goose chase. And Fritz has no "agenda" and that's what came up with the high match up numbers. Bitch at it.
03 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by no1marauderPerhaps there is some fault to the system you use or you wouldn't be trying so damned hard to defend it!
Perfection is not required or achievable. Nor is proof "beyond a shadow of a doubt". What is required here is "overwhelming" evidence sufficient to establish "beyond a reasonable doubt" that the person used an engine. That evaluation is made at RHP by the Site Admins, not me. They decision is clearly correct IMO based on what I know. No one has yet given no "agenda" and that's what came up with the high match up numbers. Bitch at it.
How do you know you are even doing it right, as you wouldn't be privy to the information on how the REAL GAME MODS were doing it, OR WERE YOU?
04 Jan 09
Originally posted by Very RustyI know what the Game Mods want in the analysis forwarded to them as evidence (as many do) for a simple reason: I ASKED THEM.
Perhaps there is some fault to the system you use or you wouldn't be trying so damned hard to defend it!
How do you know you are even doing it right, as you wouldn't be privy to the information on how the REAL GAME MODS were doing it, OR WERE YOU?
How sinister!
They do have tools I lack and our privy to some information I am not. I have a fairly high degree of confidence in their ability to ID blatant cheats. Some people here clearly do not understand the methods used (even though it has been discussed in the forums in many threads) while others seem to want to deliberately present misinformation to try to confuse people. I've presented what I know regarding the system many times in these forums to combat such ignorance and misinformation. If you want to remain ignorant or prefer to believe lies then you don't have to read my posts regarding this.
04 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderHey, like I told you I read your posts to get a good laugh!
I know what the Game Mods want in the analysis forwarded to them as evidence (as many do) for a simple reason: I ASKED THEM.
How sinister!
They do have tools I lack and our privy to some information I am not. I have a fairly high degree of confidence in their ability to ID blatant cheats. Some people here clearly do not understand th ...[text shortened]... remain ignorant or prefer to believe lies then you don't have to read my posts regarding this.
Funny the mods would tell you what they wanted, I was told it was none of my concern, and they couldn't tell me anyways. What makes you so Damned Special is my question? You just ask and they tell you!
IF this is the case knowing what they are looking for, you would also know where not to go wouldn't you? Does this mean you are more trusted? Or does this mean you are privy to certain information the rest of us are not?
I am asking the questions, has nothing to do with being ignorant, as you sounded in your reply! I am questioning how you are so conifident in the system, because to be so, would mean you would have to know "ALL ABOUT HOW IT WORKS"!!!
04 Jan 09
Originally posted by Red NightThat sounds like fun!
Personally, I think it is better if we have a secret set of rules that is totally non-discernable and then have those rules enforced arbitrarily.
That will add much more excitement to the process.
We could have a bunch of secret taboo words like bubble, equivocal, potAto, etc...or something used more often like "chess" and see how long it takes people to figure out which words are taboo...furthermore, the first person who figures out one of the words will get to replace it with a word of their choice. And when a word gets replaced, everyone who got banned for that word can get unbanned.
It would be like a really cool game...!
04 Jan 09
Originally posted by Raven69Sounds like fun to me 🙂
That sounds like fun!
We could have a bunch of secret taboo words like bubble, equivocal, potAto, etc...or something used more often like "chess" and see how long it takes people to figure out which words are taboo...furthermore, the first person who figures out one of the words will get to replace it with a word of their choice. And when a word gets repl ...[text shortened]... yone who got banned for that word can get unbanned.
It would be like a really cool game...!
05 Jan 09
Originally posted by Very RustyYou and Dave can share the same tinfoil hat.
Hey, like I told you I read your posts to get a good laugh!
Funny the mods would tell you what they wanted, I was told it was none of my concern, and they couldn't tell me anyways. What makes you so Damned Special is my question? You just ask and they tell you!
IF this is the case knowing what they are looking for, you would also know where not to g ...[text shortened]... the system, because to be so, would mean you would have to know "ALL ABOUT HOW IT WORKS"!!!
You've ignored the many threads where Game Modding and Game Analysis was discussed. That is your prerogative. But to pretend you choosing to be ignorant means that those who are not got some kind of special treatment is ridiculous.
There are many people here who know the basic way the Game Mods analyze games, I'm nothing special in that regard.
05 Jan 09
Originally posted by cashthetrashIt was either 20 or 40, I no longer have access or any way to know for sure.
So which was it 20 or 40 games...and remember you are still under oath.
So the games weren't in fact verified? And because of this, it was jumped way ahead of many others still on this site that kept a crew of mods so extraordinarily busy? Suspect Mods who were also in the process of investigating each other. Very incredible.
It was not 3 games, as Carterson said. No idea where that crap number came from.
His number was either 15% or 8% percent of the actual games run. WAY OFF.
Verified? No1? They were either verified or ignored, what does it matter? The games that were run showed him a blatant cheat.
There are several people under investigation at ALL times. If RHP waited for everything to be solved before anyone is removed NO ONE would EVER be removed.
NMDB's numbers were disgusting enough for him to be banned. NUFF SAID. You're points are silly, and make no sense. Consider your daily meds in a muffin if you're not able to swallow them with a glass of water or OJ.
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