07 Jun 16
Originally posted by yoctobyteI have to agree if I understand you, salvation begins here in this life with Him.
I like josephw's post about salvation and that being from the beginning. I must admit I have never given this much thought before, I always just thought 'it was'. I would view salvation as the end result and thought about from the beginning. We are on a journey towards salvation being complete and I would offer this as a supporting reference to this ide ...[text shortened]... ork in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.[/i]
What do you think?[/b]
It is revealed during judgment day who is and is not saved.
The details of on what it takes is a different topic, but I believe it begins here.
Romans 8:23
Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by KellyJayThank you for understanding.
I used to think you actually had purpose coming here which had to do with truth as you
felt the scripture gave you. Now I just think you are a little person who only wants to rip
others without actually joining in a conversation. Your views of others and myself are
quite plain here for all to see.
You can call me deceitful by asking someone to tell me ...[text shortened]... t that you may not actually care what others think when you ask them for their views,
but I do.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by Rajk999I don't know why it matters who was first, but in looking into Acts 1 I read it was 120 gathered together as Peter was talking to them.
A couple of useful points pertaining to the Day of Pentecost:
1. The 12 Disciples and devout men out of every nation were the ones chosen to receive the Holy Spirit first. Its not any and every body.
2. Later on after Peters speech, it is the ones that choose Christ and choose to repent and change their lives are the ones who subsequently received th ...[text shortened]... y tell everyone that if they accept Christ they will receive the Holy Spirit .. thats nonsense !
Acts 1:15-16 English Standard Version (ESV)
15 In those days Peter stood up among the brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said, 16 “Brothers, the Scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David concerning Judas, who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus.
In Acts 2:1-4, everyone (each one of them) was filled with the Holy Spirit. Scripture implies that it was all and it was the 120. For in verse 5-7 the devout men heard them (the Galileans, the 120) speaking in their own tongues the mighty works of God.
Acts 2:1-8 English Standard Version (ESV)
The Coming of the Holy Spirit
2 When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. 3 And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.
5 Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. 6 And at this sound the multitude came together, and they were bewildered, because each one was hearing them speak in his own language. 7 And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? 8 And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language?
It seems to me that these devout men were not first but received the Holy Spirit a little bit later on in Acts 2:41 after Peter had finished preaching.
Acts 2:38-42 English Standard Version (ESV)
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” 40 And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” 41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.
But like I said, I don't understand why it matters (it must to you for some reason) if the devout men were first or not... it seems that ultimately they were filled by the Holy Spirit but after Peter had preached and as a part of the 3,000.
That's how I read it, do you read it differently?
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by yoctobyteIf all you gathered from what I wrote is about who was first, then you need to it read over.
I don't know why it matters who was first, but in looking into Acts 1 I read it was 120 gathered together as Peter was talking to them.
[b]Acts 1:15-16 English Standard Version (ESV)
15 In those days Peter stood up among the brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said, 16 “Brothers, the Scripture had to b ...[text shortened]... er had preached and as a part of the 3,000.
That's how I read it, do you read it differently?[/b]
I told you that you had reading difficulties.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by Rajk999Well that is your problem, telling! I asked you if you read it differently and as usual you didn't respond you resorted to less than Christ Like Behavior... good show! How is anybody suppose to understand what you mean about a thing if you are so unwilling to answer a question for clarification. I don't get it and really makes no sense at all,
If all you gathered from what I wrote is about who was first, then you need to it read over.
I told you that you had reading difficulties.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by yoctobyteMy post has nothing to do with who is first.
Well that is your problem, telling! I asked you if you read it differently and as usual you didn't respond you resorted to less than Christ Like Behavior... good show! How is anybody suppose to understand what you mean about a thing if you are so unwilling to answer a question for clarification. I don't get it and really makes no sense at all,
There is nothing to clarify.
Just read the post again.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by Rajk999You had made reference to the devout men as a 'useful point', and I know you are a stickler about the quoting of scripture accurately. The only reason that I made mention of it in my post is because this was not the first time you mentioned the "devout men" in a post... I thought this had some meaning to you and was wondering about it. But being first to receive as you have stated is not how I read it, perhaps you are bugged by that. Be assured if it had been anyone else doing the same thing you would have been all over them, telling them to read back or read forward and calling them names.... my goodness a typo of a misquoted verse gets you the title of idiot. Do you understand me?
My post has nothing to do with who is first.
There is nothing to clarify.
Just read the post again.
I believe in fruitful exchange and dialogue among brothers and learning from one another, you clearly do not feel the same and see fit to ridicule anyone and everyone. If one asks a question, look out.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by yoctobyteHe does not want anyone to know what he thinks. So asking him to be clearer is worthless.
Well that is your problem, telling! I asked you if you read it differently and as usual you didn't respond you resorted to less than Christ Like Behavior... good show! How is anybody suppose to understand what you mean about a thing if you are so unwilling to answer a question for clarification. I don't get it and really makes no sense at all,
When I asked his thoughts he accused me of being deceitful for just asking him.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by yoctobyteYou started ridiculing me several months ago.
You had made reference to the devout men as a 'useful point', and I know you are a stickler about the quoting of scripture accurately. The only reason that I made mention of it in my post is because this was not the first time you mentioned the "devout men" in a post... I thought this had some meaning to you and was wondering about it. But being first to ...[text shortened]... ot feel the same and see fit to ridicule anyone and everyone. If one asks a question, look out.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by SuzianneMy birthday is the 16th of this month...I have high hopes. 🙂
I think you'll probably have another birthday before you get an answer to this from the ones you're talking to. Yeah, the ones who "call out" and "challenge" others but who can't be bothered to answer this.
Originally posted by yoctobyteOnce a person decides to follow God, can he then sin? I am talking knowingly and unknowinglyA requirement for being made free from committing sin is to "continue in [His] word". As such, it wouldn't make sense that those Christians who do not believe His word would ever "know the truth" and be made free from committing sin
Well you still have not answered checkbaiter's question but I will let it go. I think there is an underlying ...[text shortened]... n earth, we are free from it's control but we will still do it whether knowingly or unknowingly.
Of course.
I know that continuing in the word will eventually lead to not sinning but I know there are 'slip ups' along the way. I don;t know if I believe we will ever be free from sinning while on earth
In John 8:31-35 says that His true disciples will be made free from committing sin. Not sure why you don't believe Him. But as I pointed out before: It wouldn't make sense that those Christians who do not believe Him would ever "know the truth" and be made free from committing sin since they would not "continue in [His] word".
... we are free from [sin's] control but we will still do it whether knowingly or unknowingly.
This doesn't make sense in light of John 8:34 where Jesus clearly states that EVERYONE who commits sin is the slave of sin. Do you not believe Jesus? Or do you believe that those who commit sin are both a "slave of sin" AND "free from...control"?
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by josephwJohn 8
Only idiots and liars that do not know or understand the gospel of Jesus Christ say that one needs to stop sinning to be saved.
It's irrationally illogical to think that one must stop sinning to be saved. If that were true, then Jesus died for our sins in vain.
31So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 32and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” ... 34Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin. 35“The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever.
07 Jun 16
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneYou're just a blithering lying troll. You make Jesus' death on the cross of no effect by your twisted conceptualization of the verses you quote.
John 8
31So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 32and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” ... 34Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin. 35[b]“The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever.[/b]
Unless you can state categorically that you have stopped sinning and have obtained salvation by doing so you may as well shut your lying mouth. And if you do say you have stopped sinning and have attained salvation by doing so I will call you a liar again.