Christians/Muslims

Originally posted by dj2becker
It all depends on how you define abuse. If you want to believe I was abused that's fine with me.

I don't believe you were abused. I believe you have made the whole thing up.

Originally posted by FMF
dj2becker, Is it true or false that you are a teacher? Do you have responsibility for children as an educator?

BUMP.

Originally posted by FMF
You 'following the rules' does not mean that you weren't living in a psychologically abusive environment. It's as if you have no idea what you are talking about.

I never claimed that I wasn't living in a psychologically abusive environment, I am talking about me feeling psychological abused at the time when I was there. Those who followed the rules were never harmed or mistreated. We never really knew what happened to the people that left as it was all hush hush. We were told they they fell into sin and we should have nothing to do with them. So we never heard their side of the story.

Originally posted by dj2becker
I never claimed that I wasn't living in a psychologically abusive environment, I am talking about me feeling psychological abused at the time when I was there.

You claiming that you didn't feel psychologically abused at the time does not mean that you weren't psychologically abused. If a girl thought it was OK for her father to force her to have sex with him, and submitted to it, and has since grown up ostensibly unscathed, does that mean that she wasn't sexually abused?

Originally posted by dj2becker
It depends on how you define abuse. Would you say you suffered psychological abuse as a child when you were brainwashed into believing the tooth fairy existed?

BUMP.

dj2becker: It depends on how you define abuse. Would you say you suffered psychological abuse as a child when you were brainwashed into believing the tooth fairy existed?

Originally posted by dj2becker
BUMP.

And what analogy are you trying to draw between some kiddie fiction and the account of how you were abused and brainwashed as a child (as corroborated by the link you provided)?

Are you or are you not a teacher of children as you have claimed?

Originally posted by FMF
You claiming that you didn't feel psychologically abused at the time does not mean that you weren't psychologically abused. If a girl thought it was OK for her father to force her to have sex with him, and submitted to it, and has since grown up ostensibly unscathed, does that mean that she wasn't sexually abused?

You are using a strawman to conflate my experience with sexual abuse, I was never sexually abused. Sexual abuse is clearly and objectively defined. My experience was not sexual abuse so your argument is invalid.

Originally posted by FMF
I don't believe you were abused. I believe you have made the whole thing up.

That's fine with me. You are spending a lot of time discussing something that you supposedly believe never happened.

Originally posted by FMF
And what analogy are you trying to draw between some kiddie fiction and the account of how you were abused and brainwashed as a child (as corroborated by the link you provided)?

Are you or are you not a teacher of children as you have claimed?

I am saying everyone is brainwashed as a kid, that doesn't mean that everyone who has ever been brainwashed suffered psychological abuse because of it. Do you believe you were psychologically abused when you were brainwashed into believing in the tooth fairy as a kid? Yes or No?

Originally posted by dj2becker
You are using a strawman to conflate my experience with sexual abuse, I was never sexually abused. Sexual abuse is clearly and objectively defined. My experience was not sexual abuse so your argument is invalid.

It's not a straw man. You are mistaken.

You have claimed that this thing you have described - which is quite clearly prolonged psychological abuse - was NOT psychological abuse because [1] it seemed normal to you at the time, and [2] you claim to be unscathed by it. Do you think [1] and [2] can turn 'sexual abuse' into 'not sexual abuse'?

Originally posted by dj2becker
Do you believe you were psychologically abused when you were brainwashed into believing in the tooth fairy as a kid?

And my response is the same as the first time you threw this reducto ad absurdum red herring onto the table. I want to know what analogy you are trying to draw between some kiddie fiction and the account of how you were abused, brainwashed and deprived as a child ~ as corroborated by the link to testimonies you provided.

Originally posted by dj2becker
That's fine with me. You are spending a lot of time discussing something that you supposedly believe never happened.

Are you or are you not - or have you ever been - a teacher of children as you have claimed?

Originally posted by FMF
It's not a straw man. You are mistaken.

You have claimed that this thing you have described - which is quite clearly prolonged psychological abuse - was NOT psychological abuse because [1] it seemed normal to you at the time, and [2] you claim to be unscathed by it. Do you think [1] and [2] can turn 'sexual abuse' into 'not sexual abuse'?

No that is not my claim. "Abuse" is defined as "use (something) to bad effect or for a bad purpose" or "treat with cruelty or violence, especially regularly or repeatedly."

All I am saying is that I never felt psychologically "used for a bad purpose" or "treated with violence or cruelty". That doesn't mean that I don't believe many people were.

Originally posted by FMF
And my response is the same as the first time you threw this reducto ad absurdum red herring onto the table. I want to know what analogy you are trying to draw between some kiddie fiction and the account of how you were abused, brainwashed and deprived as a child ~ as corroborated by the link to testimonies you provided.

I was brainwashed, yes, but so is a kid that believes in the tooth fairy. My beliefs did not cause me to be used for a bad purpose and neither was I treated with violence. So according the the dictionary definition of 'abuse' (not yours) I don't think I was abused. You are welcome to disagree.

Originally posted by dj2becker
All I am saying is that I never felt psychologically "used for a bad purpose" or "treated with violence or cruelty". That doesn't mean that I don't believe many people were.

[1] that the regime seemed normal to you at the time, and [2] that you claim to be unscathed by having grown up under that regime, do not turn psychological abuse into 'not psychological abuse'.