21 Oct 15
Originally posted by Rajk999"- A man is saved by Gods grace from the curse of Adams Sin or sin in the flesh"
And you need to read and UNDERSTAND AND ACCEPT WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS.
The Bible says clearly in no uncertain terms the following:
- A man is saved by Gods grace from the curse of Adams Sin or sin in the flesh
- A man must profess his faith in Christ
- A man must follow after righteousness and good works.
- Eternal life is granted by Christ at his ...[text shortened]... and falsely state. Only God know who does His works .. not you or me or sonship or Watchman Nee.
We are saved by grace through faith which is a gift of God...please read the whole Bible
"- A man must profess his faith in Christ "
Agreed
"- A man must follow after righteousness and good works."
This requires some time I don't have not, but on its face I agree, but I'm sure we disagree
on the details.
- Eternal life is granted by Christ at his return to the good and faithful servants.
We are saved by grace through faith, which is the work of God, living out our lives in the
Spirit of God doing the works God has for us is what makes us His faithful servants.
- Christians who continue with a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life.
Anyone who lives in a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life, it isn't limited to those who
call themselves Christians.
Originally posted by KellyJayWell we agree on the important thing.
"- A man is saved by Gods grace from the curse of Adams Sin or sin in the flesh"
We are saved by grace through faith which is a gift of God...please read the whole Bible
"- A man must profess his faith in Christ "
Agreed
"- A man must follow after righteousness and good works."
This requires some time I don't have not, but on its face I agree, b ...[text shortened]... rldly life will not get eternal life, it isn't limited to those who
call themselves Christians.
I said this:
Christians who continue with a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life.
You said this:
Anyone who lives in a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life, it isn't limited to those who
call themselves Christians.
Absolutely. !! Anyone.
So you are not in the Jaywill/sonship, checkbaiter, GB, RB Hill, RJHinds, Manny, Devegeester, camp,
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22 Oct 15
The real "enemy of the cross"...
It is not logical to argue that we are able to pay any of the debt demanded for our salvation. It must be paid for by another or we are not able to acquire it. As the downpayment was made by another, so must the remaining “payment” be made by another. This “payment in full” is called “propitiation,” referring to the completed work of Jesus Christ. To argue that Christ did not make the payment in full, but requires us to make the remaining payments to ensure our salvation, is to be what the Scripture calls “an enemy of the cross of Christ” (Phil. 3:18).
22 Oct 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterNobody is arguing that Christ did not pay in full. Christ payment was made in full.
The real "enemy of the cross"...
It is not logical to argue that we are able to pay any of the debt demanded for our salvation. It must be paid for by another or we are not able to acquire it. As the downpayment was made by another, so must the remaining “payment” be made by another. This “payment in full” is called “propitiation,” referring to the c ...[text shortened]... our salvation, is to be what the Scripture calls “an enemy of the cross of Christ” (Phil. 3:18).
However the Bible is very clear. Continuous and willful sin is not what Christ died for.
Enemies of the cross come in many varieties:
- Jews in the time of Paul arguing that Christ did not die neither resurrected
- Christians much like yourself that abuse the privilege of having Christ died for their sins only to go back into the black hole of worldliness and sin that leads to certain damnation
22 Oct 15
1 edit
Originally posted by Rajk999I believe I misspoke, it isn't limited to those who call themselves Christian, isn't saying that
Well we agree on the important thing.
I said this:
[b]Christians who continue with a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life.
You said this:
Anyone who lives in a sinful worldly life will not get eternal life, it isn't limited to those who
call themselves Christians.
Absolutely. !! Anyone.
So you are not in the Jaywill/sonship, checkbaiter, GB, RB Hill, RJHinds, Manny, Devegeester, camp,[/b]
only Christians will be saved, I don't care what you call yourself! You have to be right with
God through Jesus Christ, the labels are meaningless.
22 Oct 15
Originally posted by KellyJayAnd as usual I keep saying that it is God / Christ who has the decision about who is right with them. No man knows that.
I believe I misspoke, it isn't limited to those who call themselves Christian, isn't saying that
only Christians will be saved, I don't care what you call yourself! You have to be right with
God through Jesus Christ, the labels are meaningless.
Originally posted by Rajk999Well, God does give us His Spirit, which is an earnest of our inheritance, and as the
And as usual I keep saying that it is God / Christ who has the decision about who is right with them. No man knows that.
scripture tells us if we do not have God's Spirit we do not belong to God.
Ephesians 1:12-14 (ASV)
12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ: 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation,-- in whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God's own possession, unto the praise of his glory.
We also know that Jesus said that if you didn't believe in Him you were condemned.
John 3:17-29 (ASV)
17 For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. 18 He that believeth on him is not judged: he that believeth not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only begotten Son of God.
We also know that in no other name than Jesus can we be saved.
Acts 4:11-13 (ASV)
11 He is the stone which was set at nought of you the builders, which was made the head of the corner. 12 And in none other is there salvation: for neither is there any other name under heaven, that is given among men, wherein we must be saved. 13 Now when they beheld the boldness of Peter and John, and had perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus.
So what we do know even in this life that God has setup our salvation so that in none
other is there salvation: for neither is there any other name under heaven, that is given
among men, wherein we must be saved it all is on Jesus! So anyone not in Jesus is
not going to be saved.
And to repeat some scripture you reject, we cannot work our way in.
2 Timothy 1:9
who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before times eternal,
Titus 3:5
not by works done in righteousness, which we did ourselves, but according to his mercy he saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,
Ephesians 2:8-10 (NIV)
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
We can conclude that those who are working towards being good enough will not make
it, and those out side of Jesus will not make it, those that don't have God's Spirit will not
make it. Now who they are, I cannot tell by looking at them.
22 Oct 15
Originally posted by KellyJayI think I already gave my opinion on all of these things. Here they are again:
Well, God does give us His Spirit, which is an earnest of our inheritance, and as the
scripture tells us if we do not have God's Spirit we do not belong to God.
Ephesians 1:12-14 (ASV)
12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ: 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of y ...[text shortened]... t don't have God's Spirit will not
make it. Now who they are, I cannot tell by looking at them.
1. Yes I agree - God give us His Spirit, and if if you dont have Gods Spirit you do not belong to God.
I would add [AGAIN] only God knows who has his Spirit and who does not or who belongs to him and who does not.
2. Yes - There is no other name but Jesus by which man is saved.
Again I would add that only God and Christ knows who is saved.
Christ decides who gets into the Kingdom of God. Lets leave it at that.
22 Oct 15
Originally posted by Rajk999So you agree if you do not have Jesus in this life you do not belong to Him?
I think I already gave my opinion on all of these things. Here they are again:
1. Yes I agree - God give us His Spirit, and if if you dont have Gods Spirit you do not belong to God.
I would add [AGAIN] only God knows who has his Spirit and who does not or who belongs to him and who does not.
2. Yes - There is no other name but Jesus by which man i ...[text shortened]... t knows who is saved.
Christ decides who gets into the Kingdom of God. Lets leave it at that.
Originally posted by KellyJayI dont understand that question because you seem to be referring to Christians. If you are then say that clearly. Christ knows and lives in many people .. not just Christians. You do not know who has Jesus or who Jesus has.
So you agree if you do not have Jesus in this life you do not belong to Him?
22 Oct 15
Originally posted by Rajk999It is quite simple, in this life time are the only ones saved, those with Jesus Christ in their
I dont understand that question because you seem to be referring to Christians. If you are then say that clearly. Christ knows and lives in many people .. not just Christians. You do not know who has Jesus or who Jesus has.
lives NOW?
23 Oct 15
Originally posted by Rajk999I have a hard time believing you don't understand this, but okay.
I really dont understand what you getting at. Maybe you should rephrase.
There is this life time.
There is life after death.
In this life time...if you don't have Jesus in your life, and He in yours, can you still be
saved or are you condemned?
23 Oct 15
Originally posted by KellyJayThe expression :to have Jesus in your life can mean several things. The is what I constantly tell you about you being vague.
I have a hard time believing you don't understand this, but okay.
There is this life time.
There is life after death.
In this life time...if you don't have Jesus in your life, and He in yours, can you still be
saved or are you condemned?
It can mean:
- I know of Christ and I believe Christ existed
- I believe that Christ died for me
- I am a Christian, I was baptised
- I know the teachings of Christ
- My parents were Christians
- I follow the teachings of Christ
- I read my bible every day.
It can mean one or several of the above.
Personally I would not use the expression 'to have Jesus in your life" because it has many meanings. For me following the teachings of Jesus is what having Jesus in your life is all about and I would use that expression.
23 Oct 15
3 edits
Originally posted by Rajk999No, it doesn't mean any of those at all!
The expression :[b]to have Jesus in your life can mean several things. The is what I constantly tell you about you being vague.
It can mean:
- I know of Christ and I believe Christ existed
- I believe that Christ died for me
- I am a Christian, I was baptised
- I know the teachings of Christ
- My parents were Christians
- I follow the teachings ...[text shortened]... achings of Jesus is what having Jesus in your life is all about and I would use that expression.[/b]
All of those are things people do and believe, that was not my question to you.
Do I have to repeat it a third time, seriously?
It is all about Jesus not about us, Jesus in our lives, it isn't us but Jesus who made that
happen. So again, Jesus who knows His own, lives in His in this life, NOT what we believe
is true, but the reality of Jesus Christ!
You can say truthfully I don't know who belongs to Jesus, that doesn't mean that Jesus
doesn't know them, and if there are those that belong to Him, what does that mean to
those that are not His?
You can say truthfully that I don't know who has God's Spirit in this life, but that does not
mean that God does not know who has God's Spirit, if some have His Spirit, what does
that mean for those that do not have it?
You can say truthfully that I don't know who has been born again, but that does not mean
that Jesus doesn't know who was, and if there are those that are born again, what of
those that are not?
Jesus said that those that did not believe in Him were condemn already, so what is to
become of them?
Do you believe God enters into the lives of people today, that we actually fellowship with
Him, getting to know Him? Is it for you all about us reaching Him by our actions, by our
beliefs, by our works?