Living in Truth.

@secondson said
Is it possible for one to be an asshat and screw up the meaning and correct application of Romans 3:20,21 and 3:28 and still be a member of the church of Jesus Christ?

Yes or no?

Here is the whole story of what justification is about from Paul

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. (Galatians 2:16-17 KJV)

For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? (Romans 6:14-16 KJV)

Faith in Christ and the avoidance of sin is what makes one justified
Those who proclaim their faith and still continue to sin and disobey Christ will die.
Those who continue on with obedience to Christ will get eternal life.

@rajk999 said
Here is the whole story of what justification is about from Paul

[i]Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. But if, while we seek to be just ...[text shortened]... disobey Christ will die.
Those who continue on with obedience to Christ will get eternal life.[/b]

Secondson is upset with me because I used Romans whatever it was to remind him that his behaviour in this forum doesn’t reflect the behaviour he was piously calling for.

@divegeester said
Secondson is upset with me because I used Romans whatever it was to remind him that his behaviour in this forum doesn’t reflect the behaviour he was piously calling for.

Ok. In this thread, what page ?

@divegeester said
And yet you are hardly ever here. You’re full of crap old chap.

First sentence valid. Second one should rather have been omitted...

I’m also hardly ever here, but that does (i suppose) give me the right to post on odd occasions, no?

@rajk999 said
What you do not realize is that your posts sound like cut and pastes from the JW website rather than from the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles, whose focus is righteousness and good works. It is not about going door to door, or not being part of this world and Satan is in control of the world BS. You also fail to address clearly and concisely questions address to you. Nobody will take your posts seriously unless you take them seriously also.

Lets try this again and see if I get it right this time.
We all believe what we believe and in accord will no doubt give statements and answers that reflect that, right? But, you and and a couple others here just don't accept that and feel that we should answer in some non correct way to our beliefs for you, and just ignore what we believe and answer in the way and that you'll accept. Correct?
So again ..... we should answer your questions or post comments in a way that you believe to be spiritually correct? Is this what you're saying?

And just asking but you are saying that Jesus and all that he taught like going door to door is BS? Really? So I can tear those pages out of the bible because you say it's BS?

@caljust said
First sentence valid. Second one should rather have been omitted...

I’m also hardly ever here, but that does (i suppose) give me the right to post on odd occasions, no?

The two sentences are not connected.

Galveston75 was bleating about the quality of the posting here and yet he is rarely here having chosen to flounce off in a hissy fit at least half a dozen times.

The second sentence refers to his own content which is generally speaking regurgitated, cultish, scientifically dangerous, doctrinally hateful and bullying (not his words, the doctrines), defensive of the covering up of child sex abused by his cult and he is generally avoiding head to head debate.

So yeah, pretty crappy.

@galveston75 said
Lets try this again and see if I get it right this time.
We all believe what we believe and in accord will no doubt give statements and answers that reflect that, right? But, you and and a couple others here just don't accept that and feel that we should answer in some non correct way to our beliefs for you, and just ignore what we believe and answer in the way and tha ...[text shortened]... oing door to door is BS? Really? So I can tear those pages out of the bible because you say it's BS?

Ok let’s give it a go...third time of asking Galveston75;

In reference to your post the other day:
Is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it there, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church?
Yes or no?

@CalJust

What I meant when I said: do not just say “Jesus is the Truth,” but what it actually MEANS TO YOU that Jesus is the Truth. How do you live? How does it affect your choices, etc.

Notice that when Pilate retorted to Jesus "What is truth?" Jesus remained silent. Truth was standing before Pilate and almost, but not quite, recognized it.

He knew at least this - Jesus was innocent and had done nothing so bad as to deserve execution. Pilate knew the truth to THAT extent. But he was trapped, caught, and ensnared in his own politics to make sure he looked good to his boss, Caesar in Rome.

He caved in and went 100% against his human conscience KNOWING something of the truth. Jesus was good. Jesus was not only good. He was gloriously good. But Pilate cared more about his own skin.

But what is truth ? Here the truth is a man living totally in the realm and sphere of the living God. The truth was Jesus one with His Father in every way - in motive, in intention, in desire, in will, in thought, in imagination.

I think you have to combine the three matters ofJohn 14:6 together to get some idea of what the truth was in heart of Jesus.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father except through Me. (JOhn 14:6)

The way to live is a living Person - the Son of God.
The genuine truth, the reality of life is a living Person - the Son of God.
The destination to which the way leads is also a living Person - the Father, God. No one comes ... to the Father .... except through Me.

This is about a man being one with an uncreated Life which is supreme, eternal, everlasting, completely right and righteous, full of love, glorious, indestructible.

This is not easy. And believers in the Son of God who might try to answer are all learners.

But the way, the truth, and the life are something meant not for Jesus alone but for all those into whom Jesus comes to bring He and His Father into them to put them on the same way.

Here is one place we see this:

"As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who eats Me shall also live because of Me."(John 6:57)

This means the truth came to bring others into the same truth - men and women living in the sphere and realm of the Triune God.

This touches on your OP a little.

I am not limiting, or excluding , the fact that, for example, the Bible says that Jesus said this. I know too many people (and some of them right here on RHP SF) who glibly quote pious phrases but one sees very little of it in their lives.

But the truth has come down through the centuries through all kinds of opposition. In spite of lots of Christians that you do not approve of, the truth is still spreading and being spoken of and frankly lived by believers to varying degrees of depth.

Whenever people rise up to point out the failure of Christians I recall Paul's words - who, shall bring a charge against God's redeemed, justified people?

This is not a licensed to be failures as Christians. But it is the sober recognition that if God is for us who can be against us?

Read it here:

What shall we say then to these things? IF God is for us, who can be against us?

He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not also with Him freely give us all things?

Who shall bring a charge against God's chosen ones? It is God who justifies.

Who is he that condemns? It is Christ Jesus who died, but rather who was raised, who is even at the right and of God, who also intercedes for us.

Who shall separate us from the love of Christ ... (See Romans 8:31-35a)

Again, this is not an excuse to be defeated Christians, or lukewarm, or backslidden, or continue as spiritual babies living the life of sin and the world. Judgement begins with the house of God.

But it is a solid rock of Gods justification to stand on. God has justified. Who can condemn when God has justified ?

So with patience we should continue to learn the lessons of living in oneness with this available, real, resurrected Person Jesus Who astoundingly can blend Himself into our innermost being so as we live a live in union with Christ.

@divegeester said
Ok let’s give it a go...third time of asking Galveston75;

In reference to your post the other day:
Is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it there, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church?
Yes or no?

Lol. Why would I do this again? Why would I take time out of my day to answer you and a few others a question that I've probably answered about 10 times by now? It will still be the same as the other 10 times and it will still be the same the same the next ten times that you will with no doubt ask again? Really I promise it will still be the same "always". So simply go pack to the postings that I made those comments on and guess what? The answer is there just like the other 10 times. Isn't this forum great because it keeps all of our postings and you can actually go back and find anything I've ever said here. Give it a try!!!!

@galveston75 said
Lol. Why would I do this again? Why would I take time out of my day to answer you and a few others a question that I've probably answered about 10 times by now? It will still be the same as the other 10 times and it will still be the same the same the next ten times that you will with no doubt ask again? Really I promise it will still be the same "always". So simply go pa ...[text shortened]... f our postings and you can actually go back and find anything I've ever said here. Give it a try!!!!

It’s a “yes “ or a “no” Galveston75.

It took you about 50 times as long to write the post I’m replying to.

@divegeester said
Is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it there, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church?
Yes or no?

H dive - I realise that it is very dangerous for a third party to get involved in a dog fight - I might get bitten myself!

But seriously, why is this question important to you? It’s almost the same as the question: have you stopped beating your wife.

Case A: He says no, it isn’t. That makes JWs an exclusive sect. So what? How many other Christian posters here have issues of exclusivity - I’m pretty sure many of them would NOT recognise me as a Christian because I accept evolution and reject the literal interpretation of the Bible. All of us (or at least most, because I haven’t) have drawn boundaries around what WE believe is the truth.

Case B: He says yes, it is possible. That might satisfy you, but would (could?) put him in conflict with his own church teaching. Is that what you want? To expose him as being lenient and accommodating?

I am (seriously!) not sure what you would gain by either answer, and why you are pushing him into a corner.

@caljust said
H dive - I realise that it is very dangerous for a third party to get involved in a dog fight - I might get bitten myself!

But seriously, why is this question important to you? It’s almost the same as the question: have you stopped beating your wife.

Case A: He says no, it isn’t. That makes JWs an exclusive sect. So what? How many other Christian posters here have issue ...[text shortened]... eriously!) not sure what you would gain by either answer, and why you are pushing him into a corner.

Thanks for your input. I won't bite. Yes I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. I know this because this exact issue and questioning and harassment has come up many, many times and I'm tired of his games.
I wish the forum was watched more by the moderator and would help out with these type situations. I don't want anyone banned but just want all to be respectful to everyone even if they think their answers are stupid or just not answering for a personal reason or just because they don't want to.
It doesn't matter the reason at all and the one that is refusing to engage has every right to say no and should not be followed and hounded at every chance they can see to do it..... But then again some get really out of hand hiding behind a monitor screen...

The apostle John as a very senior and advanced disciple of Jesus spoke very matter of factly about the truth as a way to live. Some examples from his Second Epistle:

Salutation:

The elder to the chosen lady and to her children, whom I love in the truth, and not only I, but also all those who have known the truth. (1 John 1:1)

This truth lives in the believers and will be with them for eternity.

"Because of the truth which abides in us and shall be with us forever." (v.2)

The truth proceeds from the Triune God. The truth is linked strongly with divine love.

"Grace, mercy, peace shall be with us from God the Father and from Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, [b]in truth and love." (v.3)

The Apostle John is so happy to know that some of the believers are walking in truth, just like the were commanded to do.

"I rejoice greatly that I have found some of your children walking in truth, even as we received commandment from the Father. " (v.4)

They obeyed the commandment to walk, step by step, in truth.

This walking in truth is expressing also love for one another in the church.

And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, even as you heard from the beginning, that you should walk in it. (v.6)

There is no walking in truth if there is no walking in divine agape love.

Again in his Third Epistle Johns greatest joy is that believers he cared for are walking and living in the truth.

I have no greater joy than these things, that I hear that my children are walking in the truth." ( 3 John 4)