Spirituality
20 Aug 09
20 Aug 09
Who would like to join a discussion about the Book of Amos? This isn’t a book that gets as much attention as some of the junk, like Revalation, but I think it is much more interesting.
I will start by noting the strong anti-commercial, anti-capitalist stance taken in Amos. Some would claim it is only a condemnation of the excesses of a capitalist mode of exchange, but I say it is a condemnation of that entire system itself. The entire notion of buying and selling for profit is under attack.
Amos 8:4
Hear this, you who trample upon the needy, and bring the poor of the land to an end, saying, “When will the new moon be over, that we may sell grain? And the sabbath, that we may offer wheat for sale, that we may make the ephah small and the shekel great, and deal deceitfully with false balances, that we may buy the poor for silver and the needy for a pair of sandals, and sell the refuse of the wheat?” The Lord has sworn by the pride of Jacob; “Surely I will never forget any of their deeds.
The profit motive leads inexorably toward a separation from god. They are mutually exclusive.
Matthew 6:24
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
Alright, that’s enough to get us started.
20 Aug 09
Originally posted by rwingettFor someone who deplores the mixing of politics and religion, you certainly like to explore the 'promised land'.
Who would like to join a discussion about the Book of Amos? This isn’t a book that gets as much attention as some of the junk, like Revalation, but I think it is much more interesting.
I will start by noting the strong anti-commercial, anti-capitalist stance taken in Amos. Some would claim it is only a condemnation of the excesses of a capitalist mode o ...[text shortened]... pise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.[/i]
Alright, that’s enough to get us started.
21 Aug 09
Originally posted by divegeesterIt's a great topic of interest. Even as an atheist, I think religion could serve a useful purpose in the world. It currently does not, but it could. If Christians realize that their religion has little in common with what Jesus actually said, it could be updated for a post-theistic 21st century.
For someone who deplores the mixing of politics and religion, you certainly like to explore the 'promised land'.
But getting back to the topic at hand, do you have an opinion on the Book of Amos?
21 Aug 09
3 edits
Originally posted by rwingettExcuse me but I missed the part about government stepping in and taking a certain percentage from the masses so THEY can decide how to divy it up as well as decide who the "poor" are. Of course, they do this while all the while they live high on a hog preaching to us how we should pay our fair share. Of course, that is when they even decide to pay the taxes they impose on themselves.
Who would like to join a discussion about the Book of Amos? This isn’t a book that gets as much attention as some of the junk, like Revalation, but I think it is much more interesting.
I will start by noting the strong anti-commercial, anti-capitalist stance taken in Amos. Some would claim it is only a condemnation of the excesses of a capitalist mode o ...[text shortened]... pise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.[/i]
Alright, that’s enough to get us started.
Woops, my bad, that is in the book of Marx, not Amos. I just feel bad for the wealthy men in the bible such a Abraham and Job. Surely their wealth damned them for all eternity seeing as how they never gave it up entirely.
21 Aug 09
Originally posted by whodeyIf you have anything to say about the Book of Amos, then please do. If you're going to jabber on like a monkey, then please go back to the debates forum.
Excuse me but I missed the part about government stepping in and taking a certain percentage from the masses so THEY can decide how to divy it up as well as decide who the "poor" are. Of course, they do this while all the while they live high on a hog preaching to us how we should pay our fair share. Of course, that is when they even decide to pay the taxes ...[text shortened]... Surely their wealth damned them for all eternity seeing as how they never gave it up entirely.
21 Aug 09
1 edit
Originally posted by rwingettI am merely pointing out that there is no comparison to modern socialism today and what the Bible had to say regarding to the matter. Sure, people were encouraged to give to the poor. In fact, you might even say they were expected to do so in certain circumstances. Ironically, however, this was never imposed/regulated by the state of Israel nor was it suggested to be.
If you have anything to say about the Book of Amos, then please do. If you're going to jabber on like a monkey, then please go back to the debates forum.
21 Aug 09
Originally posted by whodeyI have never claimed that there is any comparison between modern socialism and what the bible has to say. I have gone to great lengths to specifically avoid just that, but you don't seem to want to hear it.
I am merely pointing out that there is no comparison to modern socialism today and what the Bible had to say regarding to the matter. Sure, people were encouraged to give to the poor. In fact, you might even say they were expected to do so in certain circumstances. Ironically, however, this was never imposed/regulated by the state of Israel nor was it suggested to be.
I have never suggested that the state of Israel imposed or regulated the treatment of the poor, and am not suggesting that Jesus said they should. Once again, you simply don't want to hear what I have been saying all along.
I suggest you go back and reread every post I have ever made on the subject.
21 Aug 09
Originally posted by whodeyThomas Jefferson said that Revelation was "merely the ravings of a maniac, no more worthy nor capable of explanation than the incoherences of our own nightly dreams."
As a matter of fact, pretty much all of it can be pulled from various parts of the OT. People who say it is junk simply are ignorant as to this fact.
21 Aug 09
Originally posted by rwingettHe also rejected the notion that Jesus Christ was resurrected from the dead. So your point is?
Thomas Jefferson said that Revelation was "merely the ravings of a maniac, no more worthy nor capable of explanation than the incoherences of our own nightly dreams."
21 Aug 09
1 edit
Originally posted by rwingettSo what of Abraham and Job? Christ certainly did not think ill of them for their "wealth" Nor did the author of Amos.
I have never claimed that there is any comparison between modern socialism and what the bible has to say. I have gone to great lengths to specifically avoid just that, but you don't seem to want to hear it.
I have never suggested that the state of Israel imposed or regulated the treatment of the poor, and am not suggesting that Jesus said they should. O ng all along.
I suggest you go back and reread every post I have ever made on the subject.
21 Aug 09
1 edit
Originally posted by whodeyThat is the topic for another day. This topic is about the Book of Amos. Do you have anything relevant to that discussion or not?
So what of Abraham and Job? Christ certainly did not think ill of them for their "wealth" Nor did the author of Amos.
I am certainly not the only one to raise these questions before. If you go to Wikipedia, you'll see there are entries on both Christian Socialism and Christian Communism. It is a current that has run through the Christian churches since the very beginning.