Tricky questions

Originally posted by googlefudge
Well it obviously exists "as an idea".

However I would contest that when someone says that something 'exists' they
mean that it has an existence in and of itself.

Ideas 'exist' in that ideas are physical configurations of neurons, or are encoded
in the physical structures of books or hard-drives ect.

But when we say something exists we mean ...[text shortened]... no. -1^(1/2) does not 'exist' in and of itself. It's an idea, a concept, not an existent thing.

When i read your comments, the first thing that came to mind are theroies and the thoughts of people like Einstine, Tesla and others. (Ok spelling is off, deal with it.)

Thier ideas became theroies and in some cases were not proven for years.

Originally posted by googlefudge
Well it obviously exists "as an idea".

However I would contest that when someone says that something 'exists' they
mean that it has an existence in and of itself.

Ideas 'exist' in that ideas are physical configurations of neurons, or are encoded
in the physical structures of books or hard-drives ect.

But when we say something exists we mean ...[text shortened]... no. -1^(1/2) does not 'exist' in and of itself. It's an idea, a concept, not an existent thing.

So you are happy with the statement "Darkness does not exist" ?

Originally posted by SwissGambit
I think you should explore some of these topics. I, for one, get bored with all the JW bashing, and the eternal argument over whether faith or works actually save a person.

For one, the original church was just people meeting in one another's homes. Maybe that has been lost in the modern obsession with ornate buildings?! Maybe there should not be a giant building at all. Where Would Jesus Have Church?

My personal favorite churches are the small ones, where people take time to say, "Hi" .

Originally posted by googlefudge
'Direct' detection is not a requirement.

There are plenty of things that were discovered and proved to exist via indirect means.

"exist" seems to have many meanings when you think about it.

Inm answer to "wHAT is the sqrt of -1?"
I am sure you would not say
"It does not exist"

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Does the square root of -1 exist?

I would say to define something gives it existence ... if only as an idea.

I really like what you wrote Wolf.

Originally posted by Pudgenik
When i read your comments, the first thing that came to mind are theroies and the thoughts of people like Einstine, Tesla and others. (Ok spelling is off, deal with it.)

Thier ideas became theroies and in some cases were not proven for years.

Well what they proposed were hypothesis untill they were substantiated enough to become theories...

But theories don't 'exist' either.

Theories are explanations of phenomena.
The phenomena may exist, the theory doesn't.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
So you are happy with the statement "Darkness does not exist" ?

Yes.

As much as I might enjoy getting metaphorical about stuff in fictional work,
in reality there is no such THING as darkness to be existent.

[Unless as I said someone actually discovers a darkness particle?]

Originally posted by wolfgang59
"exist" seems to have many meanings when you think about it.

Inm answer to "wHAT is the sqrt of -1?"
I am sure you would not say
"It does not exist"

The square root of minus one is purely imaginary. 😉

Originally posted by FabianFnas
I ask again why it is good to divide the world population in two (and two only) groups.

In what group do you find muslims?
In what group do you find buddhists?
In what group do you find agnostics?
In what group do I belong?

Simple, you belong to the group heretofore known as those people.

😀

Originally posted by googlefudge
Well what they proposed were hypothesis untill they were substantiated enough to become theories...

But theories don't 'exist' either.

Theories are explanations of phenomena.
The phenomena may exist, the theory doesn't.

Maybe i don't know the correct definition of 'theory'. Tesla had ideas of gravity, sound and vibrations that were unheard of at the time he wrote his ideas.

In my mind the process begins as an idea, then the developement of a theory, then a hypothesis. If something is substantiated it isn't a theory any more.

This area is a little high brow for me, so let me know if this process is right or wrong, thanks, pudge

Originally posted by Pudgenik
Maybe i don't know the correct definition of 'theory'. Tesla had ideas of gravity, sound and vibrations that were unheard of at the time he wrote his ideas.

In my mind the process begins as an idea, then the developement of a theory, then a hypothesis. If something is substantiated it isn't a theory any more.

This area is a little high brow for me, so let me know if this process is right or wrong, thanks, pudge

It's wrong I'm afraid.

In science [which is what we are talking about] you first have observations
about the world/universe/reality we live in.

You then try to create a coherent explanation for these collected observations.
These proposed possible explanations are called hypotheses.

Having come up with a proposed explanation you then use that explanation to
make predictions about our reality which you then go and test.

If the hypothesis is good enough and withstands enough rigorous testing so
that it has withstood every test we can think of and passed every one, then
it may graduate to being a theory.

Originally posted by googlefudge
Yes.

As much as I might enjoy getting metaphorical about stuff in fictional work,
in reality there is no such THING as darkness to be existent.

[Unless as I said someone actually discovers a darkness particle?]

One day you will find yourself in darkness, then you will know darkness exists.

Originally posted by RJHinds
One day you will find yourself in darkness, then you will know darkness exists.

That doesn't help him now, Ron, just like you're not doing Christianity any favors, either.