29 Aug 20
@lemon-lime saidHave you read the Republican platform they didn't want you to see? If you "are not exactly thrilled at the idea of being servants of the State", then why do you back a government (Trump, McConnell, Barr, Pompeo, the new 'gang of four' ) who wants you to be a servant of the State? Why do you, through your words and your vote, back the mobs in the street, i.e. the white militias who are killing blacks in the streets? Why do you continue to spew out their fairy-tales that it is blacks "destroying the country", when it is anarchic white supremacists "destroying the country" for a giggle while pinning it on blacks? Who is going to save you from the fascists once the "socialists" are gone?
A clever answer, but the preamble does not exclude groups of people you might find personally objectionable.
In reality the 'people' of The Peoples Republic of China is the State... the people who are able to exercise power for themselves and for their own benefit.
Like it or not, most Americans are not exactly thrilled at the idea of being servants of the State. We've enjoyed our freedoms and self autonomy for too long to simply give it all up in a few short years.
You guys are as dumb as Trump's constituency. Oh, wait...
@suzianne saidSuzianne I can only respond with one point to get you back to reality."Servant of the State". Bernie is a Registereed socialist. Secondly, AOC is truly a creature. Socialism is government ownership of means of production, and forcing any means necessary to make everyone equal. (This would actually be impossible, because some people work harder than others....there could not be equality, could there.)
Have you read the Republican platform they didn't want you to see? If you "are not exactly thrilled at the idea of being servants of the State", then why do you back a government (Trump, McConnell, Barr, Pompeo, the new 'gang of four' ) who wants you to be a servant of the State? Why do you, through your words and your vote, back the mobs in the street, i.e. the white mili ...[text shortened]... scists once the "socialists" are gone?
You guys are as dumb as Trump's constituency. Oh, wait...
So, correct me, maturely, if I am wrong. You are saying that our citizens are presently 'Servants of the State". Are you thus saying that when Bernie, et al, take over, we will NOT be servants of the state anymore? That socialism will free us? Will you look up the word Liberty and say that with a straight face.
You see, if Bernie wins, the government will naturally take a huge role in our lives. You and I will indeed be servants of the state. You see how confusing your ideas are. Your comment? (Dont mention the word Trump, someone did that last week)
@averagejoe1 saidNo.
Socialism is government ownership of means of production
Socialism is when the means of production are controlled by the people as a WHOLE. The means of production owned by the government instead of with the people is not Socialism.
29 Aug 20
@vivify saidVivify, if you control production, you control the PEOPLE.
No.
Socialism is when the means of production are controlled by the people as a WHOLE. The means of production owned by the government instead of with the people is not Socialism.
That's the problem with socialism, and more so, communism/marxism
29 Aug 20
@vivify saidOK. Could you elaborate, with all due respects. A bit confusing, your 2 sentences.
No.
Socialism is when the means of production are controlled by the people as a WHOLE. The means of production owned by the government instead of with the people is not Socialism.
1) The people 'control' the means of production.
2)Then you say, the government 'owns' the means of production. A bit dizzying.
Please close this with a simple explanation. And why do you say 'as a whole'?
29 Aug 20
@earl-of-trumps saidExactly. So the fact that the rich control production means that they control the People.
Vivify, if you control production, you control the PEOPLE.
That's the problem with socialism, and more so, communism/marxism
That's the problem with laissez faire capitalism.
29 Aug 20
@averagejoe1 saidBernie's and AOC's version of "socialism" has very little direct government control of production.
Suzianne I can only respond with one point to get you back to reality."Servant of the State". Bernie is a Registereed socialist. Secondly, AOC is truly a creature. Socialism is government ownership of means of production, and forcing any means necessary to make everyone equal. (This would actually be impossible, because some people work harder than others....there coul ...[text shortened]... confusing your ideas are. Your comment? (Dont mention the word Trump, someone did that last week)
"Socialism" properly defined is:
"a social system in which the producers possess both political power and the means of producing and distributing goods."
http://www.spunk.org/library/intro/faq/sp001547/secA1.html#seca14
29 Aug 20
1 edit
Here's how US capitalism actually works:
American Airlines was approved for $5.8 BILLION dollars in Federal aid in May. https://www.businesstraveller.com/features/these-airlines-have-received-a-bailout/
American Airlines CEO was paid $11,571,714 in 2019.
3) American Airlines has spent $11,900,000,000 on stock buybacks over the past 5 years.
3) American Airlines announced it's cutting 19,000 jobs the moment federal aid expires in October.
https://twitter.com/Public_Citizen/status/1299705113183911937
29 Aug 20
@averagejoe1 saidYou misread my post. Reread it.
OK. Could you elaborate, with all due respects. A bit confusing, your 2 sentences.
1) The people 'control' the means of production.
2)Then you say, the government 'owns' the means of production. A bit dizzying.
Please close this with a simple explanation. And why do you say 'as a whole'?
The community is the whole: the people, the government, etc, is all part of the whole, collectively distributing the means of production.
29 Aug 20
1 edit
@vivify saidSo who oversees, who regulates what goes on,, who 'decides' on stuff, if you will. IF 80,000,000 million people in NYC want a nicer subway, and Wyoming citizens want barb wire, who decides who gets what? Is there a group of people on a board? Will yall call it a government? So then, they decide? Who gets what? The people are subject to their whims? Where is the logic in that, to move away from liberty (freedom from government) to being controlled by the government?
You misread my post. Reread it.
Please close this with a simple explanation. And why do you say 'as a whole'?
The community is the whole: the people, the government, etc, is all part of the whole, collectively distributing the means of production.
You are aware, as I have often said, socialism is for the people, but not for the socialists.(The tyrants)
29 Aug 20
1 edit
@no1marauder saidSteve Jobs,, and now Tim Cook, control phone production. We dont have to buy them. The phones, and their pay-scales, are their business. Tell us how those capitalists control the people.
Exactly. So the fact that the rich control production means that they control the People.
That's the problem with laissez faire capitalism.
29 Aug 20
@AverageJoe1
When a phone costs a thousand dollars and up, they control how much money is spent on that because now a phone is considered a necessity not a luxury.
They make it seem like you are a country hick if you don't have a smart phone.
29 Aug 20
@averagejoe1 saidHave you ever heard of a concept called "democracy"?
So who oversees, who regulates what goes on,, who 'decides' on stuff, if you will. IF 80,000,000 million people in NYC want a nicer subway, and Wyoming citizens want barb wire, who decides who gets what? Is there a group of people on a board? Will yall call it a government? So then, they decide? Who gets what? The people are subject to their whims? Where is the logic ...[text shortened]... e aware, as I have often said, socialism is for the people, but not for the socialists.(The tyrants)
29 Aug 20
@suzianne said
Have you read the Republican platform they didn't want you to see? If you "are not exactly thrilled at the idea of being servants of the State", then why do you back a government (Trump, McConnell, Barr, Pompeo, the new 'gang of four' ) who wants you to be a servant of the State? Why do you, through your words and your vote, back the mobs in the street, i.e. the white mili ...[text shortened]... scists once the "socialists" are gone?
You guys are as dumb as Trump's constituency. Oh, wait...
Have you read the Republican platform they didn't want you to see?No. I'm only privy to a platform that can be seen.