17 Aug 04
Originally posted by SirLoseALotWell here are the four lines I have so far:
1.c4,Qe2+ 2.Kb3,Qf3+ 3.Ka4,Qc6+ 4.b5+,Qxb5+ 5.cxb5 checkmate is my line.
I didn't think of 1...,Qc6,will examine that now.
1.c4 Qe2+ 2.Kb3 Qe5! (I mean towards a sixth move) 3.Qd2 Qxa5 4.Qd6+ Qb6 5.b5+ Ka5 6.Qb4#
1.c4 Qg2+ 2.Kb3 Qc6 3.b5+ Qxb5+ 4.cxb5+ Kxb5+ 5.Qd5+ Ka6+ 6.Kc4 h4 7.Qb5#
1.c4 Qf2+ 2.Kb3 Qb6 3.b5+ Qxb5+ 4.cxb5+ Kxb5+ 5.Qd5+ Ka6+ 6.Kc4 h4 7.Qb5#
1.c4 Qc6 2.Kb3 and following alternatives
a) 2. ... Qb6 3.b5+ Qxb5+ 4.cxb5+ Kxb5 5.Qd5+ Ka6+ 6.Kc4 h4 7.Qb5#
b) 2. ... h4 3.b5+ Qxb5+ 4.cxb5+ Kxb5 5.Qd5+ Ka6+ 6.Kc4 h3 7.Qb5#
c) 2. ... Qxc8 3.Qxc8 h4 4.Ka4 h3 5.b5+
d) 2. ... Qf3+ 3.Ka4 Qd1+ 4.Qxd1 h4 5.b5#
where do I miss an extra move option for black? Could 1.c4 be the wrong move?
17 Aug 04
1 edit
Originally posted by Mephisto2Hmmm...how many of you would kill me, if I told you white's queen is on e8 instead of d8...
Well here are the four lines I have so far:
1.c4 Qe2+ 2.Kb3 Qe5! (I mean towards a sixth move) 3.Qd2 Qxa5 4.Qd6+ Qb6 5.b5+ Ka5 6.Qb4#
1.c4 Qg2+ 2.Kb3 Qc6 3.b5+ Qxb5+ 4.cxb5+ Kxb5+ 5.Qd5+ Ka6+ 6.Kc4 h4 7.Qb5#
1.c4 Qf2+ 2.Kb3 Qb6 3 ...[text shortened]... miss an extra move option for black? Could 1.c4 be the wrong move?
I am terribly sorry to all of you spending time on this. But hey, you did solve that puzzle, but try to do it with white's queen on e8. NOW it's white to move and mate in 8.
-TT
17 Aug 04
Originally posted by TimmyToiletYes, it changes a lot. The white queen doesn't cover square d1, making a check possible on the king if he goes to a4.
Hmmm...how many of you would kill me, if I told you white's queen is on e8 instead of d8...
I am terribly sorry to all of you spending time on this. But hey, you did solve that puzzle, but try to do it with white's queen on e8. NOW it's white to move and mate in 8.
-TT
I still think that c4 is the right move to start with. The main variations seem to be Qf3+ or Qg3+ on one hand, and Qf6+, which was not possible with the white queen on d8.
Back to the board ...
17 Aug 04
Originally posted by Mephisto2I had a look at 1. ... Qf6+ first, since this is the 'new' possibility. The importance of square d1 is many times higher than I understood in my previous post. Truly amazing that it could be worth white's queen, if the following line is valid, that is:
Yes, it changes a lot. The white queen doesn't cover square d1, making a check possible on the king if he goes to a4.
I still think that c4 is the right move to start with. The main variations seem to be Qf3+ or Qg3+ on one hand, and Qf6+, which was not possible with the white queen on d8.
Back to the board ...
1.c4 Qf6+ 2.Ka2 (avoid black giving check back on f3 with access to d1) Qf2+ 3.Ka3 Qf3+ (Qg3+ then Ka4 is possible) 4.Qe3! and now
a) QxQ 5.Ka4! and the longest path would be Qa3+ (or Qb3+) 6.KxQ h4 7.Ka4 h3 8.b5#. Black's other pieces are truly useless.
b) Qc6 (or Qh6, just the same) 5.Qh6! another square from where the black queen cannot help QxQ (all other moves are mate in 1 or 2) 6.Ka4! and black is helpless towards the threat 7.b5+ followed by 8.cxb5# (assuming black moves the queen to g5, b6 or c6.
Is this correct so far? Anybody wants to have a go at the other lines?
17 Aug 04
Originally posted by Mephisto2Ding ding ding, and Mephisto gets the prize!
I had a look at 1. ... Qf6+ first, since this is the 'new' possibility. The importance of square d1 is many times higher than I understood in my previous post. Truly amazing that it could be worth white's queen, if the following line is valid, that is:
1.c4 Qf6+ 2.Ka2 (avoid black giving check back on f3 with access to d1) Qf2+ 3.Ka3 Qf3+ (Qg3+ then ...[text shortened]... queen to g5, b6 or c6.
Is this correct so far? Anybody wants to have a go at the other lines?
The full line was:
1. c4! Qf6+ 2. Ka2! Qf2+ 3. Ka3 Qf3+ 4. Qe3!! Qf6 5. Qh6!! Qxh6 6. Ka4 Qc6+ 7. b5+ Qxb5 8. cxb5++
Good job Mephisto!
18 Aug 04
how is this simple? :-)
black pawn at h7 would have been simple.
I have been looking at this *simple* puzzle for twenty minutes. Trying all moves I could think of and nothing i do can drive the black king away from his pawn, and I find no way to get white king in there to maybe push black king around a little.. I really want to know this one.. Someone please solve it... :-)
18 Aug 04
Originally posted by chasparosstart from Timmytoilet's first move: Rb6, trapping the black king. The question is how that does lead to a win.
how is this simple? :-)
black pawn at h7 would have been simple.
I have been looking at this *simple* puzzle for twenty minutes. Trying all moves I could think of and nothing i do can drive the black king away from his pawn, and I find no way to get white king in there to maybe push black king around a little.. I really want to know this one.. Someone please solve it... :-)
18 Aug 04
3 edits
Originally posted by Mephisto21. Rb6! Ka2(Only move) 2. Ke6 a2 (2...Ka3 3. Rb7 or Rb8) 3. Kd5 Ka1(Only move) 4. Kc4 a2 5. Kb3! (Blocking the stalemate...5. Kc3?? Stalemate!) Kb1(Only move) 6. Rf6! a1=Q 7. Rf1#
start from Timmytoilet's first move: Rb6, trapping the black king. The question is how that does lead to a win.
And if 6...a1=N+ 7. Kc3
7...Ka2 8. Rb6! It's hopeless already but to avoid checkmate (8...Ka3 Ra6# ), black has to give up the knight with either Nc2 or Nb3
7...Nc2 8. Rf1+ Ka2 9. Kxc2
I think that's right....
-Tim
18 Aug 04
Originally posted by TimmyToiletYes, well done! You even had the little trick promotion a1N+ right.
1. Rb6! Ka2(Only move) 2. Ke6 a2 (2..Ka3 3. Rb7 or Rb8) 3. Kd5 Ka1(Only move) 4. Kc4 a2 5. Kb3! (Blocking the stalemate...5. Kc3?? Stalemate!) Kb1(Only move) 6. Rf6! a1=Q (6...a1=N+ 7. Kc3 Ka2 8. Rb6! [Picks up the knight and if 8...Ka3 9. Ra6#] ) 7. Rf1#
I think that's right....
-Tim