@sonship saidWitness Lee on the Christian churches past
@Rajk999
No proof. [As expected]
Case closed.
Reaction after reaction meant division after division. Eventually, God’s goal was damaged. This has been the main reason that the Lord has not yet returned. He could not return because there was nothing for Him to come back to. In order for Him to come back, He needs a “steppingstone.” This steppingstone is the proper church life that prepares the church as the bride for His coming. Even though there have been thousands and thousands of real believers, there has been a shortage of the proper church life.
https://www.ministrybooks.org/books.cfm?p
Summary:
1. All Christian Churches have created divisions and Gods goal was damaged
2. Christ cannot return because there is NOTHING to return to. This means that none of the Christians in other churches are worthy of Christ return
3. The Local Church si the only church with the proper church life.
4. Therefore only after this Local Church develops can Christ return.
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Reaction after reaction meant division after division.
Christ petitioned the Father that all His believers would eventually be perfected into one.
"That they all may be one even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us that the world may believe that You have sent Me.
And the glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one; I in them, and You in Me, that they may be PERFECTED into one, that the world may know that You have sent Me and have loved them even as You have loved Me." (John 17:21-223)
Needless to the Son of God's desire, will, plan, and request of the Father is for oneness of His people.
Eventually, God’s goal was damaged.
Division damages the expression of the "one new man" which Christ came to die for to create in Himself.
"And have put on the new man, which is being renewed unto full knowledge according to the image of Him who created him, Where there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free man, but Christ is all and in all." (Col 3:10,11)
In what Christ came to renew there "CANNOT BE" old fleshly divisions, stratifications, schisms cultural, or other wise. But the renewing from oldness to the expression of Christ in all and being lived out in all - shinning out from all - regulating all - manifested in all - "but Christ is all and in all"
Eventually, God’s goal was damaged.
The oldness of stunted spiritual growth is a damage to the body of Christ.
The apostle Paul says not that there SHOULD NOT be, but that there "CANNOT BE" such schism in the church.
"For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There cannot be Jew nor Greek, there cannot be slave nor free, there cannot be male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." (Gal. 3:27,28)
To attempt to build the church with aspects of the old man, unrenewed, untransformed is to mar the church, thus damage it. It is to defile the temple of God and to destroy its holy nature.
" According to the grace of God given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid a foundation, and another builds upon it. But let each man take heed how he builds upon it.
For another foundation no one is able to lay besides that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. But if anyone builds upon the foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, grass, stubble, the work of each will become manifest; for the day will declare it, because it is revealed by fire, and the fire itself will prove each one's work, of what sort it is."(1 Cor. 3:10-13)
Gold, silver, precious stones are the non-combustable aspects of God's nature, Christ's redemption, and the Holy Spirit's transformation. That is the operation of the Triune God in people to produce the building of God on the unique foundation of Jesus Christ.
Wood, grass, stubble represent the combustible things of the old man like culture, religion in the flesh, natural activity, and other things found abundance among human culture yet will not pass approved in the fiery judgment of Christ's examination.
"If anyone's work which he has built upon the foundation remains, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is consumed, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire." (vs. 14,15)
In other words the Lord Jesus will grant reward for HOW you built His house on Him as the foundation. The precious things of the operation of the Triune God will stand the examination's fire and merit a reward in the kingdom. The worthless things which will all burn up under Christ's holy examination damaged His house and will cause the builder to suffer loss. But he will still be saved though he is disciplined for damaging the oneness and nature of the Lord's holy temple.
" Do you not know that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? If anyone destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him; for the temple of God is holy, and such are you." (vs.16,17)
Witness Lee was FAITHFUL to warn Christians that we need to build the temple of God, with the valuable things of the Father's divine nature, the Son's redemptive work, and Spirit's transformation of our souls - gold, silver, precious stones.
To try to build the church with the old man is to mar the temple and destroy it. It cannot be destroyed but if in our neglegience to growth in God's life we defile it with worthless things of the fallen nature, this will cause the Christian to lose the reward of the thousand year kingdom. He will suffer this lose but will still be eternally saved.
The oldness of the untransformed nature will be destroyed for it attempted to destroy the temple of the living God.
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This has been the main reason that the Lord has not yet returned.
Jesus wants to return to a mature woman as a wife not a teenage girl.
He has had many mature individuals in every age of the church.
But He longs to come back to a critical mass of a corporate mature woman wooing Him back in love.
Besides, there is no crime in any servant of God expressing his desire for Christ to return and his reasons why he thinks that blessed hope is delayed.
What is wrong with lovers of Jesus seeking to ascertain why their Loving Bridegroom delays?
The questions are not for Rajk999.
These replies are not written for the benefit of Rajk999.
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29 Sep 21
1 edit
Rajk999's "Summary" contained errors.
Summary:
1. All Christian Churches have created divisions and Gods goal was damaged
That cannot be found in the paragraph sited.
Locate for me "all Christian Churches" anywhere in the paragraph.
2. Christ cannot return because there is NOTHING to return to. This means that none of the Christians in other churches are worthy of Christ return
In the concluding rapture of the seed growing in the earth it is the HARVEST, the MATURITY, the RIPENESS that caused the farmer to reap his crop.
"And I saw, and behold, there was a white cloud, and on the cloud One like the Son of Man sitting, having a golden crown on His head and a sharp sickle in His hand.
And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, Send forth Your sickle and reap, for the hour to reap has come because the harvest of the earth is ripe. And He who sat on the cloud thrust His sickle upon the earth, and the earth was reaped." (Rev. 14:14-16)
It is important to see that the REAPING is because THE HARVEST is fully ripe. It does not say the time to reap has come because Antichrist is such a bother.
It is the GROWTH Into MATURITY of the crop that causes the reaping at the proper hour.
God has ways to give incentive for us to grow in the divine life. He will cause the circumstances to arise that His people hate the world and only long to be filled up with Christ as their life. The HARVEST OF THE EARTH is the drying out in the wheat if the worldly water and their readiness because of maturity.
The Parable of the Seed (Mark 4:26-29)
"And He said, So is the kingdom of God as if a man cast seed on the earth, and sleeps and rises night and day, and the seed srpouts and lengthens - how, he does not know.
The earth bears fruit by itself: first a blade, then an ear, then full grain in the ear.
But when the fruit is ripe, immediately he sends forth the sickle, because the hargest has come."
It is not because the corn stalks or wheat stalks were "bad" or "unloved" but because the RIPENESS had not yet taken place. It is the same with the Christians on earth. This is the implication of Rajk999's twistings. He seems incapable of realizing the Christians growing crop on earth.
"For we [the apostles[/b] are God's fellow workers; you are God's cultivated land [/b] [or farm] God's building. (1 Cor. 3:9)
3. The Local Church si the only church with the proper church life.
It said "proper church life" not The Local Church.
He did not say "My Church" or "The Witness Lee Church".
4. Therefore only after this Local Church develops can Christ return.
That is not what he said. The proper church life is a farm where Christ is planted, watered, and caused to GROW in people, building them together.
"I planted, Apollos watered, but God caused to growth. (1 Cor. 3:6)
So then neither is he who plants anything nor he who waters, but God who causes the growth. (v.7)
For we are God's fellow workers; you are God's cultivated land, God's building." (v.9)
You cannot fault God's servants for wanting to establish proper church life environment so that Christ may GROW in people into whom He has been planted.
So Lee labored to establish proper farms where the norm is Christ growing and building the saints together.
How can you fault a servant of God for wanting to provide the best environments for God to accomplish His growing in saved people?
The church in Corinth was no a utopia. She had plenty of problems.
Paul saught to make it an environment where Christ has the last word eventually in everyone. That is a proper church life. And divisions and denominations slow down the growing processes because practical oneness is the best fertile ground for God's life to grow.
Why take a long route when there is a more direct route?
29 Sep 21
@sonship saidSo you believe that the only correct church is the Local Church because that is the only church that qualifies as the bride of Christ. Christ will return only when His Bride, which is the Local Church is ready.
Rajk999's "Summary" contained errors.
Summary:
1. All Christian Churches have created divisions and Gods goal was damaged
That cannot be found in the paragraph sited.
Locate for me "all Christian Churches" anywhere in the paragraph.
[quote]
2. Christ cannot return because there is NOTHING to return to. This means that none of the Christians ...[text shortened]... ertile ground for God's life to grow.
Why take a long route when there is a more direct route?
Witness Lee is a Cult Leader.
You are a Cult Follower
Both of you are stupid morons.
So stop with the lame excuses.
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29 Sep 21
1 edit
@Rajk999
I believe that I have grown bored with the monotony of debunking you for about a decade. That's what I believe.
I can't remember the last time or ever where your opinion could not be easily refuted.
@sonship saidLol... Jesus is waiting on the Local Church to return.
@Rajk999
I believe that I have grown bored with the monotony of debunking you for about a decade. That's what I believe.
I can't remember the last time or ever where your opinion could not be easily refuted.
😀 .. Are you serious?
You really are a dunce.
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30 Sep 21
3 edits
Mocking will occur in these last days.
Twisted and slanderous mockings.
What is important to know is that Jesus said before the church of brotherly love, Philadelphia, He put an open door which no one was able to shut.
Why should Christians not seek to see what conditions Jesus recommends for which such an un-closable door is set ? Should we be discouraged from seeking His heart because of slanderous mockers like this Rajk999 ?
"And to the messenger of the church in Phaldelphia [brotherly love] These things says the Holy One, the true One, the One who has the key of David [the is the key to the Messianic kingdom] , the One who opens and no one will shut, and shuts and no one opens" (Rev. 1:7)
Mockers will come to shut the door. They themselves will not enter into the kingdom and they wish to shut the door to others as well, mocking, scoffing, jeering.
Whatever the Lord does to prepare some to enter, slanderous mockers will accuse them of presumptuousness - You think YOUR GROUP inc. will prepare themselves to meet Jesus ??? Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha !! "
Brother Witness Lee said "the proper church life" should be recovered. Slanderous twistings make this sound like "HIS GROUP inc. is going to being Jesus back".
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2 edits
Regardless of the mocking from unbelievers, Jesus said that some with a little strength yet faithful, to them an open door which Rajk999 types cannot shut, will be before these lovers of Christ and one another.
"I know your works: behold, I have put before you an opened door which no one can shut, because you have a little power and have kept My word and have not denied My name.
Behold, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, those who call themselves Jews and are not, but lie - behold, I will cause them to come and fall prostrate before your feet and to know that I have loved you."
We do not take this as guaranteed success of any group. But WHY NOT seek the Lord's desire that such a people be prepared for Him? Where is the arrogance in wanting to live in such a way and church in such a way that His good pleasure is met?
Apparently, included in the word is Jesus saying some taunting mouths will be eating their words as Jesus demonstrates that with such a people He is pleased in spite of their religious mockings.
Mockings like this:
Lol... Jesus is waiting on the Local Church to return.
😀 .. Are you serious?
You really are a dunce.
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30 Sep 21
Lol... Jesus is waiting on the Local Church to return.
😀 .. Are you serious?
You really are a dunce.
"Knowing this first, that in the last days mockers will come with mocking, going on according to their own lusts. . . . " (2 Pet. 3:3)
Rajk999 is right on time.