Go back
Reasons for disbelief in the Christian God

Reasons for disbelief in the Christian God

Spirituality

R
Standard memberRemoved

Joined
03 Jan 13
Moves
13080
Clock
16 May 19
4 edits

So Ghost argues that the existence of great tragedies of apparently undeserved misfortune and suffering is evidence that God does not exist.

Two questions I would ask Ghost.

1.) Is there absolutely no one in your life who has ever suffered unduly because of actions that YOU ...Ghost-of-a-Duke took ?

2.) If within the next hour God were to balance perfectly the scales of justice upon every wrong doing that caused an innocent person to suffer unduly, would you, Ghost-of-Duke be punished for the suffering you caused someone?

Or would you just be there congratulating God for FINALLY dealing with everyone ELSE as justice demands. But YOU would be just an exempt condoning bystander telling God that it is about time He made it all right ?

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19

@kellyjay said
You know if it doesn't make sense to you okay, I thought your post was well said.
The first two paragraphs of your post didn’t make much sense.

Nevertheless my assertion remains that the question: “why does god permit a child to suffer?” Is exactly the same question from whoever asks it. The difference is that some, people are going through the suffering personally and find the generalised platitudes offered by contemporary Christianity to be an insufficient explanation.

dj2becker

Joined
01 Oct 04
Moves
12095
Clock
16 May 19

@divegeester said
The first two paragraphs of your post didn’t make much sense.

Nevertheless my assertion remains that the question: “why does god permit a child to suffer?” Is exactly the same question from whoever asks it. The difference is that some, people are going through the suffering personally and find the generalised platitudes offered by contemporary Christianity to be an insufficient explanation.
Does the suffering of children in any way cause you to doubt the existence of God?

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19

@dj2becker said
Does the suffering of children in any way cause you to doubt the existence of God?
Yes.

Ghost of a Duke

Joined
14 Mar 15
Moves
29602
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@philokalia said
Um, sure, I guess there is a point at which it is more responsible to use a lot of pain killers on your child or -- the worst thing ever -- there have been circumstances where a child has needed to be put out of their misery due to the intense suffering that they had and the inability to do any else.

And that is an extremely morbid topic. But we are adults here ...[text shortened]... ying to disprove the validity of God by looking for extreme outlier scenarios of children suffering.
Don't like the suffering of children as a reason for disbelief in the Christian God? How about the suffering of animals?

'The sufferings of millions of the lower animals throughout almost endless time' are apparently irreconcilable with the existence of a creator of 'unbounded' goodness. (Charles Darwin).

This is perhaps better explained by Michael Almeida:

1. God is omnipotent, omniscient and wholly good.
2. The evil of extensive animal suffering exists.
3. Necessarily, God can actualize an evolutionary perfect world.
4. Necessarily, God can actualize an evolutionary perfect world only if God does actualize an evolutionary perfect world.
5. Necessarily, God actualized an evolutionary perfect world.

If #1 is true then either #2 or #5 is true, but not both. This is a contradiction, so #1 is not true.

Ghost of a Duke

Joined
14 Mar 15
Moves
29602
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@dj2becker said
Does the suffering of children in any way cause you to doubt the existence of God?
If anyone answers 'no' to this, seek help.

dj2becker

Joined
01 Oct 04
Moves
12095
Clock
16 May 19

@divegeester said
Yes.
Yet you still believe in God so it’s not a deal breaker.

Ghost of a Duke

Joined
14 Mar 15
Moves
29602
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@sonship said
So Ghost argues that the existence of great tragedies of apparently undeserved misfortune and suffering is evidence that God does not exist.

Two questions I would ask Ghost.

1.) Is there absolutely no one in your life who has ever suffered unduly because of actions that YOU ...Ghost-of-a-Duke took ?

2.) If within the next hour God were to balance ...[text shortened]... would be just an exempt condoning bystander telling God that it is about time He made it all right ?
I am not a child suffering from a terminal illness nor have I caused a child to suffer from a terminal illness. Feel free to contribute something relevant to the thread.


When becker previously (and repeatedly) used the analogy of 'torturing babies for fun' in relation to moral absolutes, you defended him doing so by saying it was understandable that he would use extreme examples to get his point across. - Well, here I am using an extreme example to get 'my' point across. Yes, it is an uncomfortable one, and I can understand why you would prefer to deflect away from it or personalize it.

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@dj2becker said
Yet you still believe in God so it’s not a deal breaker.
What “deal” are you referring to?

dj2becker

Joined
01 Oct 04
Moves
12095
Clock
16 May 19

@divegeester said
What “deal” are you referring to?
A deal breaker in terms of your belief in God.

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@dj2becker said
A deal breaker in terms of your belief in God.
You seem to run into a cul de sac.

dj2becker

Joined
01 Oct 04
Moves
12095
Clock
16 May 19
1 edit

@divegeester said
You seem to run into a cul de sac.
You don’t seem to understand what a deal breaker is. Or you’re just being obtuse.

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@dj2becker said
You don’t seem to understand what a deal breaker is. Or you’re just being obtuse.
Of course I know what it is, but I was discussing the question of children suffering with KellyJay and you just blurted off a question and now you have immediately run out of steam.

As I said, you seem to have run into a cul de sac.

dj2becker

Joined
01 Oct 04
Moves
12095
Clock
16 May 19

@divegeester said
Of course I know what it is, but I was discussing the question of children suffering with KellyJay and you just blurted off a question and now you have immediately run out of steam.

As I said, you seem to have run into a cul de sac.
The point you’re seemingly missing is that suffering children may cause you to doubt the existence of God but it’s not a deal breaker. So the question is why is it a deal breaker for ghost?

divegeester
watching in dismay

STARMERGEDDON

Joined
16 Feb 08
Moves
120597
Clock
16 May 19
Vote Up
Vote Down

@dj2becker said
The point you’re seemingly missing is that suffering children may cause you to doubt the existence of God but it’s not a deal breaker. So the question is why is it a deal breaker for ghost?
Perhaps you should present your “dealbreaker” idea to him rather than me.

Cookies help us deliver our Services. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Learn More.