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When in doubt I turn to a pearl of wisdom from Lee:
"The sun signifies Christ...the moon can be considered a figure of the church, the wife of Christ...the stars first signify Christ…although Christ is the real sun, He does not appear as the sun during the present age of night. Rather, He shines as the bright Morning Star." (The Recovery Version: Footnotes of Genesis)
So insightful...
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If only you could see Witness Lee as clearly.
Seems we are into repetition of previous weak arguments now.
What would you like me to see about this man ?
I see that you scratch your head at some things which appear as "foolishness" expounded because of your lack of spiritual experience. That I see. As Paul told the Corinthians.
Somethings explained about chess make sense to me. Other things do not do much for me because I have not reached a certain capacity to appreciate what is being pointed out.
That is in the natural realm. In the spiritual realm it is similar. It is not a shame to be not ready in capacity to hear something. But it is prudent to start with the simpler and more basic matters.
That is if you were really interested and not just hunting for reasons to embrace your atheism anyway.
No Ghost, I've observed Lee for a long time. He is now deceased and people like you will have to hunt for someone else to blame as the move of God continues minus Witness Lee being with us.
Besides, his treatment of Genesis there about the moon, stars, etc. is in NO WAY a problem to the basic tenets of the Christian faith.
Does no harm to God's existence.
Does no harm to God's plan of salvation.
Does no harm to God incarnating and becoming a Man Jesus.
Does no harm to His life, His redemptive death, and His vindicating resurrection.
If this is the only thing which makes you want to raise an alarm of "cult, cult, cult" it isn't very much to be alarmed about.
Lee put out 100 plus outlines on how to preach a gospel message. The book is called Volume One and Volume Two of "Gospel Outlines"
Why don't you go through those points to find something you think is REALLY heterodox and worth running away yelling "Cult, Cult" at.
Here's a sample of what you'd be getting into.
Gospel Outlines
CONTENTS
Part One: Old Testament Subjects
Outlines 1-10
1. The Origin of the Universe—God
2. The Meaning of the Universe—God
3. The Center of the Universe—Man
4. The Evil One of the Universe—the Devil, Satan
5. The Tragedy of the Universe—the Fall of Man
6. The Glad Tidings of the Universe—the Gospel
7. The Savior of the Universe—Christ
8. The Relationship between God and Man
9. Life versus Good and Evil
10. “Where Are You?”—in a Lost Condition
Outlines 11-20
11. “Where Are You?”—in Sins
12. “Where Are You?”—under Condemnation
13. “Where Are You?”—under Wrath
14. “Where Are You?”—in Death
15. “Where Are You?”—in Darkness
16. “Where Are You?”—in the Hand of Satan
17. Man’s Religion and God’s Saving Way
18. The Way to Escape Death
19. The Corruption of the World and the Deliverance of God
20. God’s Calling
Outlines 21-30
21. The Judgment of Sodom
22. The Election of Grace
23. Man under the Power of Satan
24. Detained by Satan
25. The Passover
26. The Rock and the Living Water
27. The Law of Mount Sinai
28. Being Cleansed from Leprosy
29. Lifting Up the Bronze Serpent
30. The Cities of Refuge
I see there are 266 ways to deliver a concise Christian Gospel message there.
The preface writes.
This book is more than just a compilation of riches; it is also a practical training in gospel preaching. The outline style mingles the points of the gospel messages with valuable instruction on how to preach the gospel. The reader is helped, therefore, not only in what to preach but also in how to do it most effectively. We can testify that as we have put this material to use, we have been greatly helped in our preaching and have experienced the Lord’s rich blessing upon our meetings.
https://www.ministrybooks.org/books.cfm?id=2BC2CEC5
Why not look to those 266 lessons on how a Christian might deliver a Gospel message. Do you to find your heterodox teaching to be alarmed about in those basic instructions ?
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And this beauty:
"The unique Creator, God, is triune, signified by the number three. Since the creation is represented before God by four living creatures (Revelation 4:6-9), the number four signifies creatures, especially man. Hence, three plus four means that God is added to the created man, and thus His purpose is being accomplished. The church is not only the creature, but the creature with the Creator as the Triune God dispensed into her. She is the real number seven: the real three, the Triune God, added to the real four, created man. Therefore the number seven denotes completion in God’s move, first in the old creation and then in the new creation, the church."
(The Recovery Version: Footnotes of Revelation)
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"The unique Creator, God, is triune, signified by the number three.
No problem here. Creation is assigned to all three of the trinity - the Father, the Son, and the Spirit.
"Let Us make man in Our image and according to Our likeness"
Nothing to be alarmed about there.
Since the creation is represented before God by four living creatures (Revelation 4:6-9), the number four signifies creatures, especially man.
By no means the invention of Witness Lee. This has been pointed out long before by careful examiners of the use of numbers in Scripture.
No serious alarm THERE either.
Hence, three plus four means that God is added to the created man, and thus His purpose is being accomplished.
No serious cause for alarm there. If it seems to forced, no problem. The things shown in symbolism this way are said many fold more times in PLAIN words.
No major cause to run away shouting 'Cult! cult! False teacher!" there.
The church is not only the creature, but the creature with the Creator as the Triune God dispensed into her.
No cause for alarm there. Paul said the church was the habitation of God in spirit. That is God dwelling in the spirits of His saved people.
Being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the cornerstone.
In whom all the building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord;
In whom you also are being built together into a dwelling place of God in spirit." ( See Eph. 2:20-22)
Nothing radical there. Perhaps neglected by the mainstream Christianity, but certainly biblical. The church as the dwelling place of God Who has come to impart Himself INTO this living habitation of God.
She is the real number seven: the real three, the Triune God, added to the real four, created man.
Not a serious problem. Maybe a bit too allegorical for some.
Not a serious sign of a false teacher or a cult.
Therefore the number seven denotes completion in God’s move, first in the old creation and then in the new creation, the church."
The significance of numbers in the Bible has been taught long before Witness Lee came along.
We take the middle road between too extremes.
That is to see too much in the use of numbers as one extreme.
The other is to deny ANY apparent significance in numbers in Scripture.
Jesus Himself drew attention to the symbolism of numbers pertaining to some miracles or signs He performed.
"Do you not understand nor remember the five loaves of the five thousand and how many handbaskets you took up?
Nor the seven loaves of the four thousand and how many baskets yu took up? " (Matthew 16:9-10)
Jesus drew their attention to:
1.) How many loaves were used.
2.) How many people were fed.
3.) How many handbaskets they were fed with.
Before Witness Lee suggested significance in biblical numbers Jesus Christ suggested there was.
Try it again a year from now. Maybe it will work then. Maybe I'll be gone then.
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Thread highlight:
'The Lord is not building His church in Christendom, which is composed of the apostate Roman Catholic Church and the Protestant denominations. This...is being fulfilled through the Lord's recovery, in which the building of the genuine church is being accomplished...Roman Catholicism and Protestantism, as well as Judaism, all [have] become an organization of Satan.'
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@Ghost-of-a-Duke
When all else fails make a strong appeal to emotions.
So if Lee was a false teacher, please indicate a few names of good true teachers of the New Testament Gospel.
Give me some names of those good teachers against which you are making a comparison of Lee as a false teacher.
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@sonship saidHomer Simpson was a better teacher:
@Ghost-of-a-Duke
When all else fails make a strong appeal to emotions.
So if Lee was a false teacher, please indicate a few names of good true teachers of the New Testament Gospel.
Give me some names of those good teachers against which you are making a comparison of Lee as a false teacher.
“I wish God were alive to see this.”
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Hey Ghost, I know "Speed kills" but it really shouldn't take all afternoon for you to come back with a reply. You're quick today. Right?
If Witness Lee is a false teacher of the Christian faith by comparison, name me two or three TRUE and GOOD teachers doing it right?
If you say "No one is!" then Lee is no better or worse then any other Christian teacher. Duh!
C'mon cult fighter. Who then are your better examples of orthodox New Testament teachers?
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@sonship saidActually, I was posting in the GF.
Hey Ghost, I know "Speed kills" but it really shouldn't take all afternoon for you to come back with a reply. You're quick today. Right?
If Witness Lee is a false teacher of the Christian faith by comparison, name me two or three TRUE and GOOD teachers doing it right?
If you say "No one is!" then Lee is no better or worse then any other Christian teacher. Duh!
C'mon cult fighter. Who then are your better examples of orthodox New Testament teachers?
Some of us have more than one string to our bow.
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@sonship saidIt was however amusing that you decided to heckle me for slowness 6 minutes after you posted a question, and then discovered I had replied within 4 minutes.
@Ghost-of-a-Duke
Homer Simpson was a better teacher:
“I wish God were alive to see this.”
Ah. So you're taking the easy way out - the lampoon?
Good for a few weak laughs.
Ouch.