Worse things than disbelief?

Originally posted by @romans1009
Then you agree with what I wrote earlier where I said since you have a problem with the concept of believing something in one’s heart that a similar way of saying that is a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief.

No. I think it is sheer nonsense to talk about thoughts originating from a different organ in one's body merely on account of them being sincere or "strong" thoughts. Why would you think I agree with this upshot of your need to resort to a poetic metaphor in order to create some sort of unreal magical information about what you believe? Please read what I am saying in my posts.

Originally posted by @fmf
No. I think it is sheer nonsense to talk about thoughts originating from a different organ in one's body merely on account of them being sincere or "strong" thoughts. Why would you think I agree with this upshot of your need to resort to a poetic metaphor in order to create some sort of unreal magical information about what you believe? Please read what I am saying in my posts.

I did read what you said and in my most recent post said you agree that what I call “heart belief” could be said in your vernacular to be “strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief.”

Forget about whether you think one can believe something in one’s heart. I know you don’t think that. But surely you think one can have a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief. That’s all I was suggesting.

Originally posted by @romans1009
I did read what you said and in my most recent post said you agree that what I call “heart belief” could be said in your vernacular to be “strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief.”

Forget about whether you think one can believe something in one’s heart. I know you don’t think that. But surely you think one can have a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief. That’s all I was suggesting.

Someone professing “strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief" is just someone thinking something.

Originally posted by @romans1009
But surely you think one can have a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief. That’s all I was suggesting.

So what? The fact that one can have a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief is not evidence of anything and certainly does not substantiate any of your superstitious ideas about yourself or divine beings.

Originally posted by @fmf
So what? The fact that one can have a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief is not evidence of anything and certainly does not substantiate any of your superstitious ideas about yourself or divine beings.

No idea why you’re going off on this tangent. I was simply suggesting that what the Bible and I refer to as belief in one’s heart is analogous in your way of thinking to a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief.

There obviously are different intensity levels of belief, as I think you previously said or indicated.

Originally posted by @romans1009
No idea why you’re going off on this tangent. I was simply suggesting that what the Bible and I refer to as belief in one’s heart is analogous in your way of thinking to a strong, sincere, committed and self-sacrificing belief.

There obviously are different intensity levels of belief, as I think you previously said or indicated.

The red herring/tangent about supposed "heart belief" is yours, not mine. So, anyway, we can agree that thoughts - regardless of how intense or sincere (or whatever) they may be - are simply thoughts.

You think Jesus rose from the dead; you think you are accepting Jesus as your "Lord" and "saviour"; you think you are "saved" and you think that this has some consequence for you after you die.

Your certainty about "everlasting life" is conjured up by a sequence of thoughts inspired by a religious doctrine that appeals to your imagination. Can we agree on this?

Originally posted by @fmf
The red herring/tangent about supposed "heart belief" is yours, not mine. So, anyway, we can agree that thoughts - regardless of how intense or sincere (or whatever) they may be - are simply thoughts.

You think Jesus rose from the dead; you think you are accepting Jesus as your "Lord" and "saviour"; you think you are "saved" and you think that this has some ...[text shortened]... houghts inspired by a religious doctrine that appeals to your imagination. Can we agree on this?

Actually, no we can’t. You came closest in the second paragraph and would have been there if you replaced “think” with “believe.”

Can we agree that there are varying degrees and intensities of beliefs?

Originally posted by @romans1009
Can we agree that there are varying degrees and intensities of beliefs?

Yes, and we can also agree that bears poo in the woods and that the pope is a Catholic.

Originally posted by @romans1009
Actually, no we can’t. You came closest in the second paragraph and would have been there if you replaced “think” with “believe.”

A belief is a thought or set of thoughts. That's all. Nothing magical aside from the wonder of our human capacity and faculties.

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.' (1 Timothy 5:8)


Is neglecting our family worse for God than not believing He exists?[/b]

You already know the correct answer.

Been wondering where rational people meet. Hook me up, please.

Originally posted by @fmf
A belief is a thought or set of thoughts. That's all. Nothing magical aside from the wonder of our human capacity and faculties.

Well we certainly disagree on this.

Here is the dictionary definition of belief:

“an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
"his belief in the value of hard work"
2.
trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
"a belief in democratic politics" “

And here’s the dictionary definition of thought:

“an idea or opinion produced by thinking or occurring suddenly in the mind.
"Maggie had a sudden thought"
synonyms: idea, notion, opinion, view, impression, feeling, theory; More
judgment, assessment, conclusion
"what are your thoughts on the matter?"
one's mind or attention.
plural noun: one's thoughts
"he's very much in our thoughts and prayers"
an act of considering or remembering someone or something.
"she hadn't given a thought to Max for some time"
an intention, hope, or idea of doing or receiving something.
"he had given up all thoughts of making Manhattan his home"
synonyms: hope, aspiration, ambition, dream; More
intention, idea, plan, design, aim
"he gave up any thought of getting a degree" “

You think these definitions of “belief” and “thought” are the same?

Originally posted by @fmf
Yes, and we can also agree that bears poo in the woods and that the pope is a Catholic.

Bears pop in shrubbery. This should not affect your world view.

Originally posted by @romans1009

Here is the dictionary definition of belief:

“an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
"his belief in the value of hard work"
2.
trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
"a belief in democratic politics" “


These are all thoughts. having confidence, trust, faith, acceptance, thinking something is true or that something exists, all thoughts, all functions of thinking.

Originally posted by @apathist
Bears pop in shrubbery. This should not affect your world view.

You returning again and again to what you seem to think is a slam dunk 'point' that " there are varying degrees and intensities of beliefs" is a discursive dud.

edit: make of this what you will, apathist!

Originally posted by @fmf
You returning again and again to what you seem to think is a slam dunk 'point' that " there are varying degrees and intensities of beliefs" is a discursive dud.

You’re aware that the post you’re responding to wasn’t written by me?