Voter ID, Badly Needed

@divegeester said
Ok so some people are, for some strange reason, conscientious objectors to General and voting ID cards, despite us having diving licence ID cards, bank and credit cards (essentially IDs), digital IDs for websites, facial ID for unlocking devices, government ID cards and digital IDs for accessing tax accounts, passports which have all our identity attached, our cars have I ...[text shortened]... ave IDs.

But the bottom line is that voter ID needs to happen and it needs to be airtight secure.

Yet still millions of citizens in the US don't have a photo ID:

"An ACLU fact sheet from May 2017 claims that 21 million Americans do not have a government-issued photo ID, citing a 2006 survey from the Brennan Center for Justice. About 11 percent of the 987 voting-age American citizens surveyed said that they did not have a current, unexpired government-issued photo ID. Eleven percent of the adult citizen population in the 2000 Census amounts to 21 million Americans.

The Brennan Center survey also found that black Americans were less likely to have a current government photo ID – 25 percent lacked one, compared to 8 percent of white Americans, with an 8 percent margin of error. It also indicated that 16 percent of Hispanics lacked one, but the results were not statistically significant due to a low sample size.

Other national surveys have similarly found that millions of Americans don’t have government-issued photo ID."

https://checkyourfact.com/2018/12/02/fact-check-millions-government-photo-id/

IF the government wants to insist you have one just to vote, which is a right, it should provide one free of charge. The fact right wingers won't say this shows what the real purpose of such measures are and it's not election security but voter suppression.

@Mott-The-Hoople said
“but it seems very unlikely that voter ID made the difference in any state Kamala won. ”

based on what?

Based on that she was up big in the polls in every state she won, and the polling error in the states that she did win were, if anything, even larger than in the states she lost.

Trump lost NJ by only 5 points after being down double digits in the polls. You think without photo voter ID, he would have won? Extremely unlikely.

@no1marauder said
Yet still millions of citizens in the US don't have a photo ID:

"An ACLU fact sheet from May 2017 claims that 21 million Americans do not have a government-issued photo ID, citing a 2006 survey from the Brennan Center for Justice. About 11 percent of the 987 voting-age American citizens surveyed said that they did not have a current, unexpired government-issued photo I ...[text shortened]... ows what the real purpose of such measures are and it's not election security but voter suppression.

I think providing a free ID is a perfectly reasonable compromise, but it's not like it costs much as it is. In NY it's between $6.50 and $14. Even for people of limited means, that not much money.

https://dmv.ny.gov/non-driver-id/non-driver-id-fees-and-refunds

If they were to give free ID, I'm sure the next thing we'll hear is that working class people don't have time to go to the DMV and wait in line to get their free ID's (which may be true enough - going to the DMV is a nightmare).

Voting is a right, but the government doesn't have to pay for your bus or uber to get to the polling place. Nominal costs associated with engaging in a right doesn't mean the right is being denied.

@sh76 said
I think providing a free ID is a perfectly reasonable compromise, but it's not like it costs much as it is. In NY it's between $6.50 and $14. Even for people of limited means, that not much money.

https://dmv.ny.gov/non-driver-id/non-driver-id-fees-and-refunds

If they were to give free ID, I'm sure the next thing we'll hear is that working class people don't have time to g ...[text shortened]... ing place. Nominal costs associated with engaging in a right doesn't mean the right is being denied.

Where millions of people would be denied that right when the "problem" could be solved at a "nominal" cost to the government, they have an obligation to do so before making citizens jump through another hoop just to exercise it.

@sh76 said
Based on that she was up big in the polls in every state she won, and the polling error in the states that she did win were, if anything, even larger than in the states she lost.

Trump lost NJ by only 5 points after being down double digits in the polls. You think without photo voter ID, he would have won? Extremely unlikely.

polls can and are manipulated, many times they are wrong.

Of course if one were planning on manipulating the vote would you also manipulate the polls?

@sh76 said
I think providing a free ID is a perfectly reasonable compromise, but it's not like it costs much as it is. In NY it's between $6.50 and $14. Even for people of limited means, that not much money.

https://dmv.ny.gov/non-driver-id/non-driver-id-fees-and-refunds

If they were to give free ID, I'm sure the next thing we'll hear is that working class people don't have time to g ...[text shortened]... ing place. Nominal costs associated with engaging in a right doesn't mean the right is being denied.

exellent point

@no1marauder said
Where millions of people would be denied that right when the "problem" could be solved at a "nominal" cost to the government, they have an obligation to do so before making citizens jump through another hoop just to exercise it.

should this “free” business only apply to voting?

what about drivers liscenses? hunting liscense?

@no1marauder said
Yet still millions of citizens in the US don't have a photo ID:

"An ACLU fact sheet from May 2017 claims that 21 million Americans do not have a government-issued photo ID, citing a 2006 survey from the Brennan Center for Justice. About 11 percent of the 987 voting-age American citizens surveyed said that they did not have a current, unexpired government-issued photo I ...[text shortened]... ows what the real purpose of such measures are and it's not election security but voter suppression.

As I said, as long as the voting register and process is airtight against fraud then there should be no problem.

Methinks you object too much to that for some reason.

@KellyJay said
Not only that, but you're in denial of all the evidence around you You're quite adept at denying what is right in front of you.

Uhuh.

God is a mental construct, you dope.
It’s a crutch to fill in the gaps of your comprehension. Nothing more.

@shavixmir said
Uhuh.

God is a mental construct, you dope.
It’s a crutch to fill in the gaps of your comprehension. Nothing more.

where did you get the mechanism to mentally construct things?

@Mott-The-Hoople said
polls can and are manipulated, many times they are wrong.

Of course if one were planning on manipulating the vote would you also manipulate the polls?

How does one political organization manipulate the polls?

While polling firms can, of course, be partisan, the parties have no control over the polling firms, and the polling firms want to be accurate so as to be taken seriously in the future.

You think Ann Selzer is happy about that fact that her reputation as a great pollster took a major hit this election?

@divegeester said
As I said, as long as the voting register and process is airtight against fraud then there should be no problem.

Methinks you object too much to that for some reason.

Well methinks you're an idiot for saying so.

I'm not in favor of voter fraud, but I'm certainly not in favor of disenfrancising millions of eligible voters to correct a "problem" that hardly exists and can be adequately addressed by less radical means.

@Mott-The-Hoople said
should this “free” business only apply to voting?

what about drivers liscenses? hunting liscense?

Neither of those are fundamental rights; voting is.

@Earl-of-Trumps said
Take a look at this map,. it shows all the states and which ones don't have voter ID.
------

The red-and-blue election state-by-state map on Thursday's "Carl Higbie FRONTLINE" noted nearly all of the states that chose Vice President Kamala Harris were ones that have no voter ID on the books.

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/voter-id-elon-musk/2024/11/10/id/1187471/

the cheating goes on.

Misleading. Some of the blue states do require identification, and there's also a bunch of red states that don't have voter id.