02 Sep 05
Originally posted by ExyNo. 1 gave evidence of some users, and that woke Russ up. Russ got some more game mods. We've looked at No. 1's work... and did work of our own.
How can you say it's "bull" when the only unofficial evidence that has been presented is No1's - for those that have looked at it, which is precious few. The GAME MODS / SITE ADMINS should be doing the job that No1 chose to do off his own back and if his evidence stands up then let the GAME MODS / SITE ADMINS present it to us, instead of a list of names, without anything else, not even removing them from the PLAYER TABLES - how sloppy is this?! 😕
What we found was less than making us happy. Hard evidence, and verified enough in our minds to make this first move. Evidence beyond a doubt presented to us by other users, beyond No. 1 alone. He just went 'public' with more than we liked. Other users have turned in evidence with engines they use to check moves.
Russ has also given us tools that I can't go into, but they are shedding light also. He's put money into this project, to make RHP a little safer for the human player.
This process is far from over, and it will take time... but it goes beyond users that use a single engine move after move like No. 1 has shown. There is hard evidence that goes beyond what No. 1 did.
If Ironman is as good as his rating and record shows, he's going to need to prove it now... RHP will eat hats. That's tough, and hard to do...
This goes beyond percentages, what the game mods have done... and what Russ has done to flush out these types of users who depend on chess engines to make their moves. Hundreds of games for every user here are available, and patterns will emerge regardless of how well users think they cover their tracks when it comes to engine use.
Before anyone slams me, I am not the best game mod. I'm one of the ones who comes up with ideas now and then. No one mod is the final voice, it comes down to all of us looking at results... and reluctantly sometimes we come to conclusions. After that, if a user can do so... they can prove they did not use engines. It will be tough, as tough as the game mods work we've been doing since December of last year.
Names finally came out today to let everyone know we are working, and we are still working. These were only the names that we are 100% sure of, and there are twice as many who are 90% and more work is being done on.
Some don't like it, some will be mad at me for saying this... but there are many many more users who trust our work, and are glad to see RHP turn into a chess site where you are ill advised to use a chess engine.
With luck, Russ will expand this team, there are people standing by right now wanting to help.
As for lawsuits, it's a chess site. Russ will need to increase his joining rates if it comes down to it... but he'll have lawyers out the ass if he needs them. If it comes down to a court of law, Ironman can play 1300 games and not lose more than 3 and that will be evidence. I am willing to watch that, but it will not happen.
P-
02 Sep 05
1 edit
Originally posted by PhlabibitWhat I don't understand is this - plain and simple - if you wouldn't stop No1marauder from presenting his Fritz analysis in public, accusing Ironman in the first instance, why is it now acceptable for the Admins to ban this user without presenting one shred of public evidence as to why?
No. 1 gave evidence of some users, and that woke Russ up. Russ got some more game mods. We've looked at No. 1's work... and did work of our own.
What we found was less than making us happy. Hard evidence, and verified enough in our minds to make this first move. Evidence beyond a doubt presented to us by other users, beyond No. 1 alone. He just ...[text shortened]... ore than 3 and that will be evidence. I am willing to watch that, but it will not happen.
P-
What you've done has not persuaded anyone that the Game Mods and Admins know what they're doing, instead it just looks like their pray to anyone who shouts as much as No1marauder in public. Bad show.
02 Sep 05
Lawsuits?? Internet usernames are pulled out of ones @ss for the most part. It is not a legal name. If iron man is who exy says he is and has stated it publicly someone is being slandered. I seriously doubt that iron man is afro....whatever, or it would be really easy for him to prove and there would be no problem.
RTh
02 Sep 05
Originally posted by ExyI guess it's faith at this point, as we can't give more evidence out than what I tried to present.
What I don't understand is this - plain and simple - if you wouldn't stop No1marauder from presenting his Fritz analysis in public, accusing Ironman in the first instance, why is it now acceptable for the Admins to ban this user without presenting one shred of public evidence as to why?
What you've done has not persuaded anyone that the Game Mods and Admi ...[text shortened]... d it just looks like their pray to anyone who shouts as much as No1marauder in public. Bad show.
I'm off for a bit... but I tried to shed some light... and I'll ask Russ and the team if we can share more.
P-
02 Sep 05
Originally posted by Exyi just dont agree with you on this point, No.1 used a PRIVATE forum to post his evidence, and therefore to suggest that he has made is evidence public is not true, and therefore public evidence from the game mods would only encourage someone to find a way of getting round the evidence and devising other ways to cheat.
What I don't understand is this - plain and simple - if you wouldn't stop No1marauder from presenting his Fritz analysis in public, accusing Ironman in the first instance, why is it now acceptable for the Admins to ban this user without presenting one shread of public evidence as to why?
What you've done has not persuaded anyone that the Game Mods and Ad ...[text shortened]... it just looks like their pray to anyone who shouts as much as No1marauder in public. Bad show.
in fairness to you, i am still unclear, despite PHLABS excellent post as to whether ironman or anyone else banned today was approached by the game mods, before they were banned. in my view this will bring the issue to a conclusion
02 Sep 05
Originally posted by PhlabibitI never claimed that my methods were anything but a "meat axe" approach, though I believe that a user who consistently matches up 85-95% with ANY engine is almost certainly cheating. I am glad to see that there are other tools available as most cheaters aren't going to be so obvious as to simply run the same engine for move after move as some of our blatant cheats bounced today apparently did. I applaud the efforts made and maybe I will back off a bit and let the Game Mods do their work now that I am satisfied that there is a serious commitment to cutting down engine use here. More I have never asked for.
No. 1 gave evidence of some users, and that woke Russ up. Russ got some more game mods. We've looked at No. 1's work... and did work of our own.
What we found was less than making us happy. Hard evidence, and verified enough in our minds to make this first move. Evidence beyond a doubt presented to us by other users, beyond No. 1 alone. He just ...[text shortened]... ore than 3 and that will be evidence. I am willing to watch that, but it will not happen.
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02 Sep 05
1 edit
Originally posted by RingtailhunterMy guess is a credit card number, used to pay for the subscription, is linked to the username. The card [I don't have one, I don't know really] probably can be linked to a name and / or address?
Lawsuits?? Internet usernames are pulled out of ones @ss for the most part. It is not a legal name. If iron man is who exy says he is and has stated it publicly someone is being slandered. I seriously doubt that iron man is afro....whatever, or it would be really easy for him to prove and there would be no problem.
RTh
02 Sep 05
Originally posted by chris stephensCome on - that's underhand semantics. No1 one used his "private" clan forum and then PUBLICALLY invited people in the open forums to come and slaver over cheat accusations. Anybody with half a brain could see through this manipulation.
i just dont agree with you on this point, No.1 used a PRIVATE forum to post his evidence, and therefore to suggest that he has made is evidence public is not true, and therefore public evidence from the game mods would only encourage someone to find a way of getting round the evidence and devising other ways to cheat.
in fairness to you, i am still ...[text shortened]... by the game mods, before they were banned. in my view this will bring the issue to a conclusion
02 Sep 05
Originally posted by AikoI don't know if russ even gets that info as he uses a service to collect the money. But as I said. I can prove who I am pretty easily if I had to, and so could ironman. I am sure that the mods gave him every chance to prove who he? was before a banning. That would only be right. They most likely sent a message or email asking for confirmation and he could not cough it up..or just ignored them.
My guess is a credit card number, used to pay for the subscription, is linked to the username. The card [I don't have one, I don't know really] probably can be linked to a name and / or address?
RTh
02 Sep 05
1 edit
Originally posted by Exyapparently it was no1 all along who supported the game mods mission . You should be thanking him for what measure his efforts helped reduce the fallout that was sure to come when Russ
I bumped your Game Mods post in General partly to give people a chance to read my reactions to your proposals, I think you'll find I agree with them. Twit.
did what was neccessary to protect the integrity of RHP, instead of attacking Russ and the game mods for acting.
What I understand is RHP used even more data than no1 did and came to the same conclusion he did. I've seen no1's data firsthand, offline and there is no doubt, none , zero, zip. no1 had it correct.
Kudos to Russ , the game mods AND no1
support your local sheriff
02 Sep 05
1 edit
Originally posted by chris stephensHe publicly announced that his evidence could be found in his private forum, and everybody who was interested were free to join. I wouldn't call that "private".
i just dont agree with you on this point, No.1 used a PRIVATE forum to post his evidence, and therefore to suggest that he has made is evidence public is not true
Edit: You guys are too fast for me...