The book of Revelation

@whodey said
The beasts and their interpretations are outlined in Daniel and somewhat in Revelation as well.

Clearly these are not literal living animals.

http://www.bibleinsight.com/beasts.html

The Fourth Beast is what Revelation expounds upon.

Don't worry about how dive describes my beliefs, he has no clue, and cannot grasp it even when it has been explained numerous times, a little to complex for him I guess.

@divegeester said
Btw. These examples are Jesus speaking using parabolic examples, he mostly spoke in parables you will remember.

2 Peter 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment;

Is this parable or symbolism as well?

So if what Jesus said was parable, what was the meaning behind it?

@whodey said
2 Peter 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment;

Is this parable or symbolism as well?

So if what Jesus said was parable, what was the meaning behind it?

Are these “chains” made of “darkness”?

Of course not. There are a metaphor as “darkness” is part of the metaphor.

@kellyjay said
Don't worry about how dive describes my beliefs, he has no clue, and cannot grasp it even when it has been explained numerous times, a little to complex for him I guess.

If writing posts like this about a poster (me), whom you don’t have the intellectual balls to directly interact with, makes you feel superior and provides you with the cognitive succour you need to help keep your squalid erroneous belief structure intact...then so be it.

@KellyJay

I think if you search enough you can find a "reads aloud" in some English version.

I recall reading it years ago. Curiosity stirs me to find out what translation had it this way. Maybe it was an old 1960s RSV.

The NIV has this. But I read that before the NIV came out.

New International Version

Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

Here's a couple more. Forgive me if I am duplicating your labors already done.

English Standard Version

Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear, and who keep what is written in it, for the time is near.

Berean Study Bible

Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear and obey what is written in it, because the time is near.

Good thing the "mouth worship" policeman Rajk999 didn't arrest them and throw them into prison.

A couple more.

International Standard Version

How blessed is the one who reads aloud and those who hear the words of this prophecy and obey what is written in it, for the time is near!

NET Bible

Blessed is the one who reads the words of this prophecy aloud, and blessed are those who hear and obey the things written in it, because the time is near!

@sonship said
@KellyJay

I think if you search enough you can find a "reads aloud" in some English version.

I recall reading it years ago. Curiosity stirs me to find out what translation had it this way. Maybe it was an old 1960s RSV.

The NIV has this. But I read that before the NIV came out.

New International Version

[b] Blessed is the one w ...[text shortened]... and blessed are those who hear and obey the things written in it, because the time is near!

A mouth worshiper like you sees the following words
- Hear
- Read
- Read aloud
- Obey
Immediately you ignore the most critical one that Jesus and all the Apostles say gives eternal life and instead focus on the ones where your mouth gets a chance to work.

[Jesus]... became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; (Hebrews 5:9 KJV)

@rajk999 said
A mouth worshiper like you sees the following words
- Hear
- Read
- Read aloud
- Obey
Immediately you ignore the most critical one that Jesus and all the Apostles say gives eternal life and instead focus on the ones where your mouth gets a chance to work.

[Jesus]... became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; (Hebrews 5:9 KJV)

No one disputes we need to obey God, no one says it isn't essential. What is the scriptural test to see if we are in the faith or not according to scripture, it isn't works, those will be judged, but they are not the test.

@kellyjay said
No one disputes we need to obey God, no one says it isn't essential.

"Need to"

"Essential"

Obligatory?

@kellyjay said
No one disputes we need to obey God, no one says it isn't essential. What is the scriptural test to see if we are in the faith or not according to scripture, it isn't works, those will be judged, but they are not the test.

Many of the faith will be cast out. Did you not read that James said that faith cannot save a man and faith without works is dead? You focus on trivialities like the Pharisees and ignore the important teachings of Christ regarding good works.

@rajk999 said
Many of the faith will be cast out. Did you not read that James said that faith cannot save a man and faith without works is dead? You focus on trivialities like the Pharisees and ignore the important teachings of Christ regarding good works.

Not the answer to the question I asked, the scripture tells to test ourselves, what is the test?

@divegeester said
Are these “chains” made of “darkness”?

Of course not. There are a metaphor as “darkness” is part of the metaphor.

You are free to continue to say that any reference to hell or the second death or damnation is simply metaphorical. In fact, you could use this line of reasoning with pretty much anything in the Bible to splain it away.

@kellyjay said
Not the answer to the question I asked, the scripture tells to test ourselves, what is the test?

Who are you to ask questions. You deny the teachings of Christ but you insist on asking dumb questions about testing yourselves.

@rajk999 said
Who are you to ask questions. You deny the teachings of Christ but you insist on asking dumb questions about testing yourselves.

It is a scriptural thing to do, it isn't me the scriptures tell us to, you don't think you are above the scriptures I assume.

If the scriptures tell us examine yourselves to see if we are in the faith, don't you think that the scriptures mean examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith?

We are to test ourselves how? What is it that we are to be looking for?

Its a Biblical question!

@whodey said
You are free to continue to say that any reference to hell or the second death or damnation is simply metaphorical. In fact, you could use this line of reasoning with pretty much anything in the Bible to splain it away.

What about the notion that the whole 'Jesus rose from the dead' thing is a metaphor and not literally true?

@kellyjay said
Revelation 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, who bore witness to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy ...[text shortened]... the opening of this book of God or man? If true and you believe, have you ever read this book aloud?

Revelation 1 English Standard Version (ESV)
John to the seven churches that are in Asia:
Grace to you and peace from him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven spirits who are before his throne, and from Jesus Christ the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of kings on earth.
To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen. Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen.


Taking these verses on face value John points out who it is that is causing this book to be written, and it didn't originate with John, but Him who is, was, and is to come and Jesus Christ firstborn from the dead, and ruler of kings on earth.

This introduction is quite different than any other book of scripture.