Why has a bee's sting evolved to be barbed?

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
ah but here is where you are wrong about me.

i do not dismiss creation, i dismiss genesis. genesis, in the light of today's discoveries is utter garbage. i believe that god made the universe, and i am interested how he done it. to achieve that knowledge i will trust hawkings and einstein and whoever other brilliant physicist comes up with, not the story ...[text shortened]... sis story. then tell me what other theory about the creation of the universe you came to trust.

I did not say I do not trust Genesis, I said I do not bring it up as my
argument about the beginning, that people like you always bring it up.

Today's discoveries, examples please! If you can accept God could
create the universe, exactly what discovery would you care to share that
shows He didn't do it the way it is written in Genesis since you have
some proof about it being false it seems?

You can trust Hawkings and Einstein, no big deal, but trust them about
what exactly?
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
I did not say I do not trust Genesis, I said I do not bring it up as my
argument about the beginning, that people like you always bring it up.

Today's discoveries, examples please! If you can accept God could
create the universe, exactly what discovery would you care to share that
shows He didn't do it the way it is written in Genesis since you have
...[text shortened]...
You can trust Hawkings and Einstein, no big deal, but trust them about
what exactly?
Kelly

But why trust this particular creation account?

I call it a story or myth, but even if you believe it's real - an account of some truth or other - why this one? Why not a hindu or an Australian aboriginal or North American native account?
What vests any more 'truth' in the Genesis account over these or any others? Because you say it? Because your priest says it? Because your mother or father or pope or reverend or friend or any one else says it?

Originally posted by daniel58
That's really strange considering that Moses lived a long time closer than hawkings or einstein, why do you trust physicists more than someone close to God since you Believe in Him? What if I said I was a physicist and I said the same thing Moses did, then you would have to Believe me or you would be lying, so that destroys that theory, dinosaurs could've ...[text shortened]... ned than there would be more people on this Earth than there are atoms this world is made of.

now now sparky, i said respectable scientists. i don't say i will swallow everything any dude with a phd tells me. but between moses that was ignorant as a rock and "may" have talked to god and hawkings who spent his all life studying and improving the theory and is renown worldwide and what he says makes sense, guess who will i pick?

who would you pick to take care of your child's cancer? the dude that claims god is talking to him or an oncologist?

dinosaurs could've walked the Earth say 6000 years ago there's no way the fossils would still exist 15 billion years later,
is that so sparky? you do realize the universe is 15 billion years, not the fossils? the dinosaurs existed until about a mere 65 million ago. and the process of fossilization does exactly that: preserve the fossil. not to mention that the bones are mostly calcium and more minerals. if you put them in the right environment there is no reason the shouldn't still exist millions years later.

also i fail to find any passage in the bible that says anyone being eaten by t-rexes. if all humans get to be related with adam and eve there must not have been a lot of them at the beginning. and at least one of them would have had to be eaten by t-rexes or raptors. and when 1 of your 10 people population dies, you would call that a noteworthy event. or did god not tell moses about the doodz that became lunch? or better still, god created a magic buble around the adam and eve clan to shield them from the dinos?

Adam and Eve only had 4 children
this goes to show just how much of the bible even a zealot understands. all the bible mentions are the male doods born on the branch that leads to noah. so that leaves out a lot of other doods and dudettes. adam and eve lived much longer than normal humans, do you think they would stop fukin?

If that happened than there would be more people on this Earth than there are atoms this world is made of
why arent there more cows than there are atoms? or more gerbils? or more tigers? oh thats right, because the resources are limited, because there are diseases, because there is war, because mankind only evolved in the last 100000 years or so and they were tiger food in the beginnings and then they clubbed each other for a field or for women and then died of flu.

Originally posted by KellyJay
I did not say I do not trust Genesis, I said I do not bring it up as my
argument about the beginning, that people like you always bring it up.

Today's discoveries, examples please! If you can accept God could
create the universe, exactly what discovery would you care to share that
shows He didn't do it the way it is written in Genesis since you have
...[text shortened]...
You can trust Hawkings and Einstein, no big deal, but trust them about
what exactly?
Kelly

but if you don't bring up genesis in your discussions with me, what other argument do you have that the world was created in 7 days? genesis claims several things, what supports those things other than some dude telling you everything written in the bible is the absolute truth?

Today's discoveries, examples please
genetics, biology, physics, carbon dating, paleonthology, geology, astrophysics and so on.
but nothing you cannot find if you google "proof genesis is crap"(feel free to rephrase)

You can trust Hawkings and Einstein, no big deal, but trust them about
what exactly?
i trust them to know about physics a lot more than an ignorant shepherd who claims to be speaking with god. not to mention even if he did talk to god, nobody can verify all he wrote was really coming from god and not a fabrication. however anything hawkings and einstein say can or will be verified. that is what science is about and that is what religion isn't

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
but if you don't bring up genesis in your discussions with me, what other argument do you have that the world was created in 7 days? genesis claims several things, what supports those things other than some dude telling you everything written in the bible is the absolute truth?

[b]Today's discoveries, examples please
genetics, biology, physics, carb ...[text shortened]... say can or will be verified. that is what science is about and that is what religion isn't[/b]

Have you seen me make the argument the world was created in
7 days? I again will not debate that, you either accept it or reject it,
it is what it is; however, with what you bring to the table we can discuss
the meaning behind your evidence, can we not? If not, than all you
have is a myth or some other story as well.
Kelly

Originally posted by amannion
But why trust this particular creation account?

I call it a story or myth, but even if you believe it's real - an account of some truth or other - why this one? Why not a hindu or an Australian aboriginal or North American native account?
What vests any more 'truth' in the Genesis account over these or any others? Because you say it? Because your priest ...[text shortened]... says it? Because your mother or father or pope or reverend or friend or any one else says it?

Because of God, I believed in Him before I read Genesis.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Because of God, I believed in Him before I read Genesis.
Kelly

Why?
What convinced you?

Originally posted by KellyJay
Because of God, I believed in Him before I read Genesis.
Kelly

and why is genesis any relevant to your belief in god?

Originally posted by KellyJay
Have you seen me make the argument the world was created in
7 days? I again will not debate that, you either accept it or reject it,
it is what it is; however, with what you bring to the table we can discuss
the meaning behind your evidence, can we not? If not, than all you
have is a myth or some other story as well.
Kelly

let me get this straight. you will not admit that genesis is false. therefore you must admit it is true. but you don't think the world was created in 7 days? or do you? or do you have another theory?

it is all hazy because you do not actually say anything. most you have said is that god rules and the bible is absolute. you also seem to think that evolution or the big bang theory has the same scientifical value as the bible. or do you? speak up man, who can we debate if you don't actually communicate anything?

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
it is all hazy because you do not actually say anything.

Also called the "KellyJay retorics".
How can you ever be proven wrong, if you don't admit anything. But everyone else can be wrong, because noone knows everything.

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
let me get this straight. you will not admit that genesis is false. therefore you must admit it is true. but you don't think the world was created in 7 days? or do you? or do you have another theory?

it is all hazy because you do not actually say anything. most you have said is that god rules and the bible is absolute. you also seem to think that evolut ...[text shortened]... bible. or do you? speak up man, who can we debate if you don't actually communicate anything?

I actually do say things; however, you on the other beleive you know
what I'm all about so you read into every post I write those things you
think I'm saying without ever stopping to just read what I said.

I do not believe Genesis is false, but feel it is a non-starter with those
that do not believe in God so I don't bother saying things like,
"Believe this because Genesis says so!" From my point of view it is
accepted scripture, and will share it, if it becomes part of the topic.
You do read a lot into my statements that I have not said.
Kelly

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
and why is genesis any relevant to your belief in god?

Because I believe in the God of the OT and NT, and I didn't always,
I became a Christian at 25, before that I had nothing to do with any
religion, after that for the first year I didn't even attend any specific
church for about a year. Instead I attending home Bible studies in
a number of different fellowships.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
I actually do say things; however, you on the other beleive you know
what I'm all about so you read into every post I write those things you
think I'm saying without ever stopping to just read what I said.

I do not believe Genesis is false, but feel it is a non-starter with those
that do not believe in God so I don't bother saying things like,
"Belie ...[text shortened]... comes part of the topic.
You do read a lot into my statements that I have not said.
Kelly

So you believe in Genesis. Then you cannot believe in the BigBang theory, because that contradicts everything written in Genesis. Right?

Originally posted by amannion
Why?
What convinced you?

My life, and God's call upon it. I cann't really give you one thing.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Because I believe in the God of the OT and NT, and I didn't always,
I became a Christian at 25, before that I had nothing to do with any
religion, after that for the first year I didn't even attend any specific
church for about a year. Instead I attending home Bible studies in
a number of different fellowships.
Kelly

So you believe in the jewish god, and you believe in the christian god. At the same time? Even when the two books contradict eachother?