13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidDo you agree with this?
And yet you can give not one example and it happened all those times.
“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.”
(Ephesians 2:8-9)
I could spend literally all night quoting verses and passages from the Holy Bible that are in direct opposition to your false doctrine.
Want another?
“Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,
And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.”
(Acts 16:29-32)
How about one from Jesus Christ? Agree with this?
“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:”
(John 11:25)
Want another from Jesus?
“And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.”
(John 6:40)
How about this one from Jesus? Agree with this?
“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.”
(John 3:3-5)
Speaking of John, how about this one from the Gospel of John. Agree with this?
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.”
(John 3:16-18)
Want more?
@rajk999 saidTitus 3:4-6
And yet you can give not one example and it happened all those times.
English Standard Version
But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
13 Feb 22
@kellyjay saidExcellent verses, KellyJay
Titus 3:4-6
English Standard Version
But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
13 Feb 22
@divegeester saidI’ve still not seen a coherent cohesive argument to support why everything which is written in the Bible has be taken as being absolute truth, morally right, totally accurate etc?
Why does everything which is written in the Bible have be taken as being absolute truth, morally right, totally accurate etc?
This is a serious honest question.
I was brought up to accept that the bible was the complete, inerrant and total word of God but I do not see evidence, even within the bible, to support that assertion.
I’m sorry if this offends and makes me deserving of abuse, but it simply isn’t there.
13 Feb 22
@kellyjay saidWhat was my comment on that verse?
Titus 3:4-6
English Standard Version
But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
13 Feb 22
@divegeester saidAgain, you are saying it is not all trustworthy; you are claiming it isn't all the Word of God. Since you are making such calls upon the Word of God, how much of it do you reject and accept, and if you are throwing out something, and keeping others, what makes those verses any better than the ones you reject. You are now claiming that there is a distinction. Do you start throwing out Genesis? If so, when do you start accepting books, if only parts, how do you justify accepting any of it and not all?
I’ve still not seen a coherent cohesive argument to support why everything which is written in the Bible has be taken as being absolute truth, morally right, totally accurate etc?
I was brought up to accept that the bible was the complete, inerrant and total word of God but I do not see evidence, even within the bible, to support that assertion.
I’m sorry if this offends and makes me deserving of abuse, but it simply isn’t there.
13 Feb 22
@divegeester said"Because the Bible tells me so "
Why does everything which is written in the Bible have be taken as being absolute truth, morally right, totally accurate etc?
This is a serious honest question.
Circular logic .
@rajk999 saidThere are years of your comments on that verse and large numbers of other passages where it is said that we are not saved because of our works; we are saved due to God's grace and mercy of God as we put our faith in His grace. You now, acknowledging that it is because of the grace of God, His mercy, we are saved because we have put our faith in Him, not because we earned it by being good through works?
What was my comment on that verse?
You have for years been saying that if we give our lives to Him, by putting our faith in Him, that is not doing the good works He has asked for and claim it is all church doctrine when verse after verse says otherwise. You have condemned those putting their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ's sacrifice for our sins.
You are forever claiming when scripture is pointing out to you how you are looking at a saved Christian on judgment day that is the end product of God's grace, not the means to get saved. The means we get saved is putting our faith and trust in Him, being born again by His Spirit within us. You have even denied those passages where the Spirit of God was sent to enter into our lives so that He could lead us to teach all things concerning God; even though the scriptures teach without the Holy Spirit in us, we do not belong to God.
13 Feb 22
@divegeester saidAnyone who believes the fairytale of Noah and the flood and believes that kangaroos and koalas made it all the way back to Australia without leaving a trace along the way is truly a special kind of a fool . Israeli archeologists have conducted extensive searches for any evidence that 600,000 people and animals wandered the desert for 40 years but found zero evidence . Most rabbis doubt there was a historical Moses .
I’ve still not seen a coherent cohesive argument to support why everything which is written in the Bible has be taken as being absolute truth, morally right, totally accurate etc?
I was brought up to accept that the bible was the complete, inerrant and total word of God but I do not see evidence, even within the bible, to support that assertion.
I’m sorry if this offends and makes me deserving of abuse, but it simply isn’t there.
Richard Carrier published a peer reviewed book on the historicity of Jesus . It is a good read .
@caissad4 saidScholars are also looking at various evidence and finding reasons to accept it and other stories about the past found in scripture. I'm not going to call people names who disagree with them or belittle their intelligence or wisdom.
Anyone who believes the fairytale of Noah and the flood and believes that kangaroos and koalas made it all the way back to Australia without leaving a trace along the way is truly a special kind of a fool . Israeli archeologists have conducted extensive searches for any evidence that 600,000 people and animals wandered the desert for 40 years but found zero evidence . Most r ...[text shortened]... .
Richard Carrier published a peer reviewed book on the historicity of Jesus . It is a good read .
13 Feb 22
@kellyjay saidI have never used that kind of church language. NEVER. What you are doing is putting my words in YOUR LANGUAGE. Hence you cannot faithfully repeat what I say, and that is tantamount to lying.
There are years of your comments on that verse and large numbers of other passages where it is said that we are not saved because of our works; we are saved due to God's grace and mercy of God as we put our faith in His grace. You now, acknowledging that it is because of the grace of God, His mercy, we are saved because we have put our faith in Him, not because we earned it ...[text shortened]... erning God; even though the scriptures teach without the Holy Spirit in us, we do not belong to God.
There is good reason why I resist the temptation to use the language of churches and follow church jargon and church expressions most of which are not in the bible. The word 'saved', has several meanings and using this word 'saved' indiscriminately creates a doctrinal mess of nonsense.
I use the language of Jesus Christ and the Apostles
Lets leave out the words of Christ and stick with what Paul said
All people are justified by the death of Christ
They are SAVED from the sin brought into the world by Adam.
Those professing faith are born again Christian Saints
The righteous Christians rule with Christ at his return
The unrighteous Christians will not inherit the Kingdom of God
I have verses to support all those statements
@rajk999 saidI'm not going to bring up ten years of your quotes to show you how wrong you are here with this. Anyone who has ever read you knows what you have said and how you belittle those you claim are doing nothing but use 'church language.' You are forever putting your claims against what the Word says, and you have even said and were quoted as suggesting that it's either Jesus (your Jesus) or the Bible and some choose the Bible.
I have never used that kind of church language. NEVER. What you are doing is putting my words in YOUR LANGUAGE. Hence you cannot faithfully repeat what I say, and that is tantamount to lying.
There is good reason why I resist the temptation to use the language of churches and follow church jargon and church expressions most of which are not in the bible. The word 'saved ...[text shortened]... Christians will not inherit the Kingdom of God[/b]
I have verses to support all those statements