Spirituality
12 Oct 19
@kellyjay saidIt matters not.
@medullah
Heads up just speak truth in love it will not matter much what you say or why, your meaning and motivation will be attacked. Some will even change your words to fit their narratives about what they think your motivation really is.
For those who want to speak with me on a sensible level that I will happily engage.
I dont understand the other stuff but it's looking rather childish and may involve chiops on shoulders ? Who can tell .
Do you have anything to do with the "Muti" guys Kelly? (or should I use the full name?)
23 Nov 19
@sonship saidCould you be clear please sonship, you are confirming here that the texts in Revelation are not to be taken literally?
Now watch.
And I saw a beast coming up out of the sea, having ten horns and seven heads and on his horns ten diadems, and on his heads names of blasphemy. (13:1)
Now having this alone, I would agree, that the beast there is probably not an individual. But look at more of the facts.
@caesar-salad saidI am indeed, there are far more second accounts posting in these forums than there are new posters for example, Sonship, SecondSon, dj2becker just for kick off.
Divegeester is prone to suspecting that some posters are actually other posters in disguise.
23 Nov 19
@medullah saidKelly or KellyJay is fine
It matters not.
For those who want to speak with me on a sensible level that I will happily engage.
I dont understand the other stuff but it's looking rather childish and may involve chiops on shoulders ? Who can tell .
Do you have anything to do with the "Muti" guys Kelly? (or should I use the full name?)
23 Nov 19
@divegeester saidI have my doubts that decondson and Sonship are the same but you could be right
I am indeed, there are far more second accounts posting in these forums than there are new posters for example, Sonship, SecondSon, dj2becker just for kick off.
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23 Nov 19
2 edits
First of all a big thank you for taking the time to produce this. I cant respond at this point as I need to look at it carefully (your work deserves proper consideration).
"And the beast ..." (17:11a)
That means the Antichrist
"And the beast who was and is not, ..." (17b)
That means that while John was writing this person had lived prior but was NOT living while John was writing.
"And the beast who was and is not, he himself is also the eight ..." (v.17c)
This is tricky. When John was writing the beast had lived in the past.
While John was writing the beast did not live, he had died.
But in the future he will live again.
In other words he is someone who died but will be living again.
"And the beast who was and is not, he himself is also the eighth and is out of the seven and goes into perdition." (v.11)
First the easiest part - "he ... goes into perdition". He goes into eternal punishment.
He is one of the seven kings. But he is the eighth king. How can this be?
23 Nov 19
@divegeester saidIf you'd have asked me a direct question instead of all this other nonesense "old chap" we could have got there sooner.
Well that only took 6 posts to get clear.
Maybe we can now discuss your claim that Daniel is the key to understanding Revelation. Could you kick off with some informative clarity on this please?
I have shown you nothing but respect, a little reciprocation will go a long way.
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23 Nov 19
8 edits
He is one of the seven kings who had already died when John was writing. But he will return to life somehow and be the eighth king.
" ... he himself is also the eighth and is out of the seven ..."
Now go back to verse 10 and gather the facts.
"And are seven kings: five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes, he must remain only a short time." (v.10)
The footnote of the Recovery Version on Rev. 17:1 helps. [my bolding]
The seven kings are seven Caesars of the Roman Empire. The first five "have fallen"; i.e., they died unnaturally (Judg. 3:25; 2 Sam. 1:10, 25, 27) Those five are Julius Caesar, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, and Nero, all of whom either were murdered or committed suicide before John wrote this book. The sixth, Domitian, who was also murdered, was living when this book was written; therefore, it is said of him that he "is." "The other," the seventh, is Antichrist; he had "not yet come" at that time. When he comes; he will remain only a short time and then will be slain and will be resuscitated by the spirit of of the fifth, who is Nero, to become the eighth."
The fifth Caesar was slain dead while John wrote Revelation.
A seventh Caesar will arise in the end times over a restored Roman Empire and will remain only a short time. He will probably be a very good man before he is assassinated. Then by Satanic miracle he is resuscitated yet with the spirit of Nero who has been in the abyss for centuries. This slain coming king will be resuscitated imitating the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Yet he comes back with the spirit of the terrible Caesar Nero. That is Nero come back to life to be the EIGHTH and final Caesar - the beast and Antichrist.
His mock resurrection from the dead will be a Satanic miracle which will deceive the world to count him as great as Christ. But he will be the terrible persecutor of God's people - Nero, alive again on the earth. And the world will worship him and Satan who vests in him such great authority.
So you see, he is out of the seven but is also the eighth.
23 Nov 19
Just as a bit of trivia, I was listening to an interview with a guy that claimed that a current USA politician had been conceived during some kind of blood magic ceremony. I dont necessarily beleive them or that anything happened as a result, but as I hope that I've indicated I have an open mind. The trick I think is not to be too ready to close your mind to possibilities.
23 Nov 19
@fmf saidSorry FMF this one slipped through my fingers.
But the people who wrote the Book of Revelation were well able to ensure it tied in with what was said in the Book of Daniel, right?
There isnt that match in common with the two books other than theme, and a clash of good and bad angles. In both cases the two scrolls are to be sealed until the time of the end when there would be more understanding.
I understand where going with this - and it's a fair line of enquiry. In Daniel we see four powers in his staue, whereas there are seven powers with the seven headed beast, plus another couple for good luck in Revelation.
So the beasts of revelation are an expansion of the statue, a more detailed account in symbolic language of how those feet would function, the iron and clay.
That's my understanding unless Sonship is about to give me a complete rethink.