The god who burns people alive for eternity

@fmf said
What would the moral purpose of torturing her for eternity in burning flames for not being "perfect in all respects to every normal inclination from the moment she was born until she became a little old lady"? What would be the moral purpose of STILL torturing her - for not being perfect while she was alive - in, say, 20,000,000 years from now?

While FMF is avoiding my questions about his mystery question, I think this is it. I am going to answer it because I will be accused of running away continuously if I do not.

+ Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
+ A woman who is an atheist but has works is not saved by her works. She also apparently does not have a faith which is going to save her, and she has apparently rejected the Gospels.

Why would her works save her?

Do you think there are people who do not sin in their hearts? Do you think there are not great philanthropists who aren't adulteresses and privately vicious?

You know, the Saints have told Christians that a good Christian who still harbors hatred for another or unforgiveness in their heart is not going to enter the Kingdom of God. I looked for the precise quotation on this but couldn't find it.

WHy would it be the case that it would be acceptable to harbor all manner of sins that go unrepented for, and to not seek to excise the desire for sin in one's heart, and to expect salvation?

(Keep in mind -- this person is not expecting salvation at all. They expect nothing.)

+ "Moral purpose" -- we know that this is loaded language. Look at Sonship's recent post where he talks about heaven as the reward/consequence, and thus hell is the punishment/consequence.

I know you don't like long posts so I will end it here.

@rajk999 said
4. You need to accept the teachings of Christ. You do not need to study any orthodox nonsense from church fathers.

One has to bear in mind that Philokalia is a recent convert to Christianity. That's why he absolutely totally and utterly nails his underpants to the torturer god ideology and yet, under scrutiny from the likes of you and divegeester, his answers to questions about the justification for it is either regurgitated dogma or answers along the lines of "I don't know", "I don't know that", "I don't know the answer yet", "I will look it up and come back and tell you"... etc.

@philokalia said
While FMF is avoiding my questions about his mystery question, I think this is it. I am going to answer it because I will be accused of running away continuously if I do not.

+ Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
+ A woman who ...[text shortened]... i]hell is the punishment/consequence.[/i]

I know you don't like long posts so I will end it here.

He does not play by the same rules he demands of others.

@rajk999 said
Wrong, on many counts.

1. Being a fool has nothing to do with lack of knowledge [biblically]. A fool is one who disobeys the commandments of Christ

2. The church cannot possibly have acurate teachings when you failed to show where your immortal soul doctrine was supported in the bible. Neither where you go the idea that hell was eternal, or heaven was eternal or that ...[text shortened]... accept the teachings of Christ. You do not need to study any orthodox nonsense from church fathers.

(1) I actually learned that the doctrine focuses on resurrection and there isn't anythign I've explicitly encountered about the soul as inherently immortal, though I recollect something to this extent that involves the concept of hell... It's just not clear to me at this point due to my lack of rigorous study of theology.

The failure is mine -- not the Church which has produced reliable and beautiful theology for two millenium.

(2) The Church are the experts who study Jesus Christ and base their teachings off of him.

What can I do that 2,000 years of top theologians have not done?

We mustn't choose to ignore the teachings of our superiors, who have truly studied these things, out of pride.

@philokalia said
While FMF is avoiding my questions about his mystery question, I think this is it. I am going to answer it because I will be accused of running away continuously if I do not.

+ Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
+ A woman who ...[text shortened]... salvation?

(Keep in mind -- this person is not expecting salvation at all. They expect nothing.)

You have dodged the question. You can set whatever criteria you want ~ whatever appeals to your imagination ~ or subscribe to whatever one of the 40,000 denominations of Christianity you want and then regurgitate their criteria for entry into the "the Kingdom of God". But this does not answer the question I asked.

@philokalia said
+ "Moral purpose" -- we know that this is loaded language. Look at Sonship's recent post where he talks about heaven as the reward/consequence, and thus [i]hell is the punishment/consequence.

This is a dodge. You think this is an answer to my question? "Look at Sonship's recent post where he..." doesn't answer my question either?

@philokalia said
While FMF is avoiding my questions about his mystery question, I think this is it. I am going to answer it because I will be accused of running away continuously if I do not.

+ Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
+ A woman who ...[text shortened]... i]hell is the punishment/consequence.[/i]

I know you don't like long posts so I will end it here.

If you're like the vast majority of Christians, the following words spoken by Jesus will fall upon deaf ears.

Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
Matthew 5
20“For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
48“Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

+ A woman who is an atheist but has works is not saved by her works. She also apparently does not have a faith which is going to save her, and she has apparently rejected the Gospels.
Matthew 16
27“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and WILL THEN REPAY EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS.
John 5
28“Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, 29and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

@philokalia said
While FMF is avoiding my questions about his mystery question, I think this is it. I am going to answer it because I will be accused of running away continuously if I do not.

+ Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
+ A woman who ...[text shortened]... i]hell is the punishment/consequence.[/i]

I know you don't like long posts so I will end it here.

Does your bible have the book of James?

@fmf said
One has to bear in mind that Philokalia is a recent convert to Christianity. That's why he absolutely totally and utterly nails his underpants to the torturer god ideology and yet, under scrutiny from the likes of you and divegeester, his answers to questions about the justification for it is either regurgitated dogma or answers along the lines of "I don't know", "I don't know that", "I don't know the answer yet", "I will look it up and come back and tell you"... etc.

Oh yes, the guy is green

@fmf said
You have dodged the question. You can set whatever criteria you want ~ whatever appeals to your imagination ~ or subscribe to whatever one of the 40,000 denominations of Christianity you want and then regurgitate their criteria for entry into the "the Kingdom of God". But this does not answer the question I asked.

OK, wait, so what is the question that I am missing?

@philokalia said
I know you don't like long posts so I will end it here.

As "long" it may or may not have been, it didn't answer the simple and concise question.

What would the moral purpose of torturing her for eternity in burning flames for not being "perfect in all respects to every normal inclination from the moment she was born until she became a little old lady"?

What would be the moral purpose of STILL torturing her - for not being perfect while she was alive - in, say, 20,000,000 years from now?

@philokalia said
OK, wait, so what is the question that I am missing?

The same one as you have dodged with your "long" answer. It's still there.

@philokalia said
(1) I actually learned that the doctrine focuses on resurrection and there isn't anythign I've explicitly encountered about the soul as inherently immortal, though I recollect something to this extent that involves the concept of hell... It's just not clear to me at this point due to my lack of rigorous study of theology.

The failure is mine -- not the Church which has ...[text shortened]... choose to ignore the teachings of our superiors, who have truly studied these things, out of pride.

Let's test your faith in the church.
Go ask a senior church father the same questions .

@fmf said
This is a dodge. You think this is an answer to my question? "Look at Sonship's recent post where he..." doesn't answer my question either?

I explained precisely why it is relevant: the afterlife does not have a purpose in the sense that it is moving towards a goal, as it is the goal itself.

Purpose can be used in many ways, though, right?

noun The object toward which one strives or for which something exists; an aim or goal: synonym: intention.
...

To have intention or design; intend; mean.
...

Import; meaning: purport; intent.

If you are asking, basically, why they burn in hell, it is because it is their just deserts as people who have turned their back on God and have not repented for the sins that they have committed, and therefore have taken on the characteristic of a metaphysical evil.

@thinkofone said
If you're like the vast majority of Christians, the following words spoken by Jesus will fall upon deaf ears.

Repentance and love and obedience to God are the criteria for the entrance into the Kingdom of God. There is no criteria for becoming absolutely & totally perfect.
Matthew 5
20“For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scrib ...[text shortened]... d deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

EVERYBODY