There seems to be many of these around. A complete Gospel Message has several core elements
- Faith and Baptism
- A change of lifestyle, repentance and avoiding sin
- Righteousness and Good Works
- The consequences of disobedience
1. The Gospel Message of Jesus Christ - The complete Gospel Message preached by Jesus Christ is recorded in the first 4 books of the New Testament and contains all 4 of the core elements. Jesus went into great detail about righteousness and good works and stated clearly all throughout His ministry that obedience to these commandments is critical for eternal life in the Kingdom of God, and that failure in this regard leads to damnation.
2. The Gospel Message of Paul [and the Apostles] - This is slightly different but still contain all 4 core elements. It is different because Paul addressed the Gentiles who had peculiar issues, such as idolatry, atheism, epicureanism, stoicism and also had the Jews condemning them for not keeping the Law of Moses and for not being circumcised. But the gospel message of Paul did contain the details of the righteousness and good works which are required for eternal life, and what happens if a professed believer disobeys the commandments.
3. The Gospel Message of Churches - There are many of these around and many of them have omitted the critical teachings about righteousness. The Gospel Message of the Churches teach about Christ, death and resurrection,about faith and baptism, but stop right there. Their gospel teaches that a profession of faith is sufficient for eternal life. Nothing else is required of them, No change of lifestyle, no avoidance of sin, no righteousness or good works. Jesus it seems washes them clean and makes them righteous and gives them eternal life, based on a profession of faith only.
If you want eternal life, listen to the gospel message of Jesus Christ. If you want to listen to Paul, then read and accept all that Paul taught. If you want hear sweet lies about getting eternal life and doing nothing, then go to church.
@rajk999 saidExcellent bullet points; how about specific references to scripture to back up each of them? How about specific references to scripture that show what you call the gospel of Jesus is actually in the Bible and not just between your ears.
There seems to be many of these around. A complete Gospel Message has several core elements
- Faith and Baptism
- A change of lifestyle, repentance and avoiding sin
- Righteousness and Good Works
- The consequences of disobedience
1. The Gospel Message of Jesus Christ - The complete Gospel Message preached by Jesus Christ is recorded in the first 4 books of ...[text shortened]... aught. If you want hear sweet lies about getting eternal life and doing nothing, then go to church.
@kellyjay saidNo, this has been done already in other threads. If I do that then I just become another sonship posting long-winded posts that nobody reads. If you profess to be a Christian and you really do not know what Jesus preached then you need to read your bible. Start with the Sermon on the Mount, in Matt 5, 6 and 7.
Excellent bullet points; how about specific references to scripture to back up each of them? How about specific references to scripture that show what you call the gospel of Jesus is actually in the Bible and not just between your ears.
The point of this thread [in case you missed it] is in the concluding paragraph. I have no intention of rehashing the details discussed previously. Again, there are 3 kinds of people :
- Those who want eternal life, they obey the Gospel of Jesus Christ
- Those who have already been indoctrinated by Paul and want eternal life, that is fine, just accept all of what Paul said because his gospel message is complete as long as it is not cut off at the point where Paul says, you are saved by grace through faith or justified by the blood of Christ . That is not the end of Pauls gospel message. Read on to the point where Paul speaks of who gets eternal life and who does not, and that point is made in every single letter to all the churches so it cannot be missed unless your aim is to deceive yourself.
- Those who want damnation ... they go and listen to the church pastor.
@rajk999 saidIf you cannot support your views with scripture they are not scriptural views they are yours alone.
No, this has been done already in other threads. If I do that then I just become another sonship posting long-winded posts that nobody reads. If you profess to be a Christian and you really do not know what Jesus preached then you need to read your bible. Start with the Sermon on the Mount, in Matt 5, 6 and 7.
The point of this thread [in case you missed it] is in the con ...[text shortened]... aim is to deceive yourself.
- Those who want damnation ... they go and listen to the church pastor.
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He doesn't know church history very well on even cursory level,
As if there were no Methodists.
As if there no Holiness denominations.
As if there were no Puritans, no Mennonites, no Plymouth Brethren, benevolent Presbyterians ever concerned with acting like Jesus as much as they could.
He thinks he is the only New Testament reader ever concerned for living a high standard of morality for Jesus.
Both exposing Rajk999 to either the Bible and Church history are fruitless.
@sonship saidI am not worried about what he thinks, his words we can see and know if they are backed up by scripture. He says a lot of things and many I agree with but where we part company he has never showed me in scripture why outside of vague references or claims he has already showed me. He always finds some reason to avoid direct questions.
He doesn't know church history very well on even cursory level,
As if there were no Methodists.
As if there no Holiness denominations.
As if there were no Puritans, no Mennonites, no Plymouth Brethren, benevolent Presbyterians ever concerned with acting like Jesus as much as they could.
He thinks he is the only New Testament reader ever concerned for livin ...[text shortened]... orality for Jesus.
Both exposing Rajk999 to either the Bible and Church history are fruitless.
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@KellyJay
It seems to be a pointedly hyper anti Reformation diatribe.
Because I am interested in truth and resolving legitimate points of real seeming contradictions, I don't mind discussing real paradoxes. But [not] with this poster.
The vitriol is too distracting.
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I mean real problematic challenges or points of tension would be good to DISCUSS.
But you cannot discuss them with Rajk999.'
Showing him passages to consider increases his anger and accomplishes nothing.
I would like to think in the past I have said "That is a good point, but you have this ... also."
I recently admitted that a passage he used in Hebrews was significant point to his view , BUT there is also other matters there to take into account.
It just makes him resentful and lashing.
It meets with vitriol and villainization which is unnatural imo.
@medullah saidNot at all. Paul and Christ are in agreement. Paul just had more to say because he was addressing the Gentiles, but that does not change the Gospel of Christ.
@Rajk999
I've never considered that what Paul had to say was in any way conflicting with that of Christ?
The churches have changed the gospel of Paul and removed certain critical elements which I have outlined above. They are in error, and you will notice that DUMB and DUMBER here are not addressing the points but trying to change the topic and discuss me instead, because what I have said is the truth. Notice they not arguing with the content of the opening post ... 😀
@rajk999 saidAnd yet when Paul is quoted you suggest that there are conflicts while only declaring them, not putting up scriptures showing the conflicts. Which means you are only giving us your opinion each time without showing why with direct scriptural quotes.
Not at all. Paul and Christ are in agreement. Paul just had more to say because he was addressing the Gentiles, but that does not change the Gospel of Christ.
The churches have changed the gospel of Paul and removed certain critical elements which I have outlined above. They are in error, and you will notice that DUMB and DUMBER here are not addressing the points but tr ...[text shortened]... what I have said is the truth. Notice they not arguing with the content of the opening post ... 😀
There isn’t a conflict between them. Except when you declare that there are with only your opinion.
One of things that have always left me a bit bewildered is that way that churches bend to the will of the state during armed conflict.
"Thou shalt not kill" should mean that. There has ben no armed conflict between nations that justified Christians getting involved that I can think of in the last 100 years, but I'm sure that i will get pelters over that expressed opinion.